Use of phosphor copper shot

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jscarmozza
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Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby jscarmozza » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:38 pm

Can, or should, 15 percent phosphor copper shot be used with yellow brass to deoxidize and improve fluidity? Ammen says no, Budget Casting says it's ok to use with any copper alloy.

RONALD
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby RONALD » Fri Sep 25, 2015 7:44 am

I use Kramer Phoscopper for almost all of my brass/bronze casting.

Here is what they say:

http://hkramer.com/phosphor-copper-shot-and-waffle.html

jscarmozza
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby jscarmozza » Sat Sep 26, 2015 6:56 am

Thanks for the information Ronald, I wasn't aware phosphorus made the casting harder! I'm making a thin item that will have to bend slightly when put in place, that's why I was going to use yellow brass instead of red brass, I thought the phosphor copper would help the metal flow through the mold. I think I'll modify the pattern and machine off the excess. Thanks again, I'll let you know how it turns out. John

jscarmozza
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby jscarmozza » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:35 am

I contacted H. Kramer Co. and asked if phosphor copper was compatible with yellow brass, the technical department responded that it wasn't. Phosphor copper should only be used with red brasses. Thanks again for the contact Ronald. John

jscarmozza
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby jscarmozza » Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:38 am

I was away from my loco project since the holidays and figured since the weather was good and I had the time I'd make the casting needed to proceed. I was casting yellow brass, a mixture of old sprues and risers, plumbing valves and fittings; as I was skimming the last melt and spotted a piece of aluminum about the size of a nickel that was trimmed off of a riser and remembered that Ammen said to use phosphor copper for red brass and aluminum for yellow brass, so I gave it a try and put the piece of aluminum in the melt. It was a #8 crucible about half full, the aluminum was the size of a nickel; I put it in closed the lid on the furnace for about a minute as I got the tongs and ladle ready to pour, when I opened the furnace I was surprised to see the metal was bright and shining and the completed casting was bright yellow. I only did it once on the last pour so I don't have any repeatable proof that the aluminum did the trick, but the other five melts were with the same metal and there was no shine on the metal and the casting surface was dull and mottled. I'd like to hear if anyone else has deox-ed yellow brass with aluminum.
John

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steamin10
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby steamin10 » Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:21 pm

Yes, I do, at one or two percent. As you can see it kicks the zinc back for oxides.. Aluminum bronze, that has a distinct golden color is made with about 25 or 30 percent Aluminum, and is quite strong, some alloys being stronger than steel, and tough.

Get into the Machinist handbook and browse some copper aluminum alloys. You will be surprised at the qualities that come out.

Brass, Bronze, and Aluminum bronze are compounds I use for cannon models of one inch bore and similar. Aluminum being cheep allows me a larger barrel without breaking the bank for material, and not sacrifice strength or saftey.

Phos is best left out of zinc compounds.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.

jscarmozza
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby jscarmozza » Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:28 pm

Hi Big Dave. So it wasn't my imagination the aluminum did make a difference. I was surprised at how dramatic the change in the look of the metal was after I put the aluminum into the melt. I learn something new every day!
John

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steamin10
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Re: Use of phosphor copper shot

Postby steamin10 » Tue Feb 14, 2017 11:10 pm

I have a problem with scrap turnings, as my local recycler does not like turnings and such like materials because they get scattered and are hard to handle for him.

So, my buckets of separated turnings get recycled by me. Any Brass, bronze goes together with other general scrap, usually no more than 10 percent by weight to keep alloy drift down, and oxides low. a few oz of aluminum near pouring time cleans up many problems for brass, and I benefit that way. In all, it is a big guessing game, and I do get lost in the woods occasionally, not using bar metal, but hey, thats part of the fun for me.

If you really need a high quality part, Everdure is the way to go, but the expense is worth the result for beautiful castings.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.


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