Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

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John Hasler
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by John Hasler »

SteveHGraham wrote:Why would the board have to come out to replace the fuse? Right now all I have to do is open the case. That was the point of installing a fuse holder. I didn't want to dig that board out again.

I have all sorts of factory electronics in my house with fuse holders mounted on the front or back. Generally, the cheap crap (power supplies, battery chargers) is what comes with fuses mounted on circuit boards.

I don't understand what you're saying about fuses having to be mounted on boards in order to prevent damage. I assume I misunderstood what you said, because fuses mounted in fuse holders do a fine job of protecting circuits.
The fuse is only supposed to blow if some component on the board has failed in such a way as to cause the board to draw so much current that additional damage (and possiby a fire) would occur. In that circumstance just replacing the fuse would be pointless: it would just blow again immediately. Therefor they might as well mount the fuse on the board and save money.

It's also possible that the authorities have decided that user replaceable fuses are unsafe.
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SteveHGraham
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by SteveHGraham »

Respectfully, if what you were saying were true, there wouldn't be much point in having fuses, because they would only blow AFTER circuits were damaged. A fuse is a circuit-protection and fire safety device. When a fuse does its job, it prevents other (more expensive) components from being harmed.

Components don't have to fail in order for fuses to blow. There are a lot of things that can make a fuse blow, such as power surges, lightning, or simply putting too much demand on a circuit. I've replaced many fuses in products that had no other damage. The subwoofer I just fixed is an example.

The location of a fuse doesn't matter. It will work no matter where you put it. You can put it outside the product, in the power cord, if you want. That's pretty much how all fuses work; even circuit board fuses are placed in series with the power source. An inconvenient PCB location just saves the manufacturer money and makes the product harder to work on.

I wouldn't say replaceable fuses are unsafe. Cars are full of fuses. Houses used to be full of them. Consumer electrical products are full of them. A soldered fuse on a PCB is somewhat unsafe, however, because it's easy to electrocute yourself by touching a nearby capacitor.

Man, I'm afraid Warmstrong will agree with me.
Every hard-fried egg began life sunny-side up.
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warmstrong1955
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by warmstrong1955 »

Oh noooooo.....
Twice in one week !!!

It's the end of life as we know it!

;)
Today's solutions are tomorrow's problems.
SteveM
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by SteveM »

A friend of mine bought a house where the electrical panel had been sheetrocked over.

My two thoughts were:
1: Run as far and as fast away from that house as possible.
2: Fire the home inspector that gave the house a thumbs up.

Steve
earlgo
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by earlgo »

And Christmas tree lights have fuses in the plugs where they are relatively easy to dig out and replace. Most strings come with extra bulbs and fuses in a little plastic bag. Admittedly the power in a light string is less than that in a sub-woofer. (LEDs have helped prevent the fire problem.)

I'm with Steve on this :shock: regarding electronics.
--earlgo
Before you do anything, you must do something else first. - Washington's principle.
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SteveHGraham
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by SteveHGraham »

Ominous.
Every hard-fried egg began life sunny-side up.
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warmstrong1955
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by warmstrong1955 »

SteveHGraham wrote:Ominous.
Doooooommmmmm......

My Fluke 87 has two fuses. I'm sure other people have forgot to change the leads after checking amperage, and then checked voltage. Poof...it'll murder both fuses.
Easy enough...open the back, (4) screws, pull out the old and push in the new.

I have a Radio Shack substitute for an 87, I bought, cause my Fluke was in my toolbox in Montana. Couldn't reach it here in Nevada.
Fuses are soldered into the board. How stupid is that?

I think it's price driven.
Even if Steve thinks so too. (Dooooooom)

;)
Bill
Today's solutions are tomorrow's problems.
John Hasler
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by John Hasler »

Of course it's cost-driven in the case of the Radio Shack meter. You give up some convenience for a lower price. Fluke, on the other hand, could make the fuse holders of solid gold and not cut into their profit margin significantly.
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warmstrong1955
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by warmstrong1955 »

My point exactly. It's price driven, and that's the general rule, for most anything.

No doubt about the Fluke being pricey. I bought mine quite a while ago, just under $180 if I remember right.
But it's survived being in many mines, in 100% humidity, and rain, hot & cold....and is still tickin'.
I dropped it off a shaft jumbo once.....it fell 25 feet. No sweat. Worst part was I had to climb down and get it.
I sure I got my money's worth. The newer 87's are about 500 bucks now. But....you can still change fuses!

:)
Bill
Today's solutions are tomorrow's problems.
SteveM
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by SteveM »

warmstrong1955 wrote:My point exactly. It's price driven, and that's the general rule, for most anything.
Even Fluke is building to a price point - just that Fluke's price point is a LOT higher than Radio Shack.

Interesting story I was told about Fluke:
A fellow I knew that repaired musical instrument electronics (amps, keyboard, etc...) told the story of the Fluke salesman that came in the shop, threw the meter on the concrete floor and THEN proceeded to do his demo.

When you think that he did that ALL DAY, you have to think about how much abuse that thing could take.

I bought my 73 more than thirty years ago, and while I have never had it put up with anything like that, it's still working.

Steve
John Hasler
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by John Hasler »

> told the story of the Fluke salesman that came in the shop, threw the meter on the concrete floor and THEN proceeded to do his demo.

Not that impressive with a solid-state digital meter. There's nothing in there that is shock-sensitive. A sturdy case with a bit of padding and Bob's your uncle. Now if he had done that with an analog meter and gotten away with it...
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warmstrong1955
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Re: Today's Dubious Use of Time and Money

Post by warmstrong1955 »

You should see what happens to a Simpson when it falls on a muckpile from about 15 feet......
Or when they make a splash in the water when you are wiring in a Flygt 58 in a rubber raft.

:)
Bill
Today's solutions are tomorrow's problems.
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