Engineers really know their stuff

[SteveHGraham]

I have another one. I inherited my dad's Ford Explorer. Water started coming in from the overhead console. I found out it was from the sunroof. I hate sunroofs. You get 10% of the fun of a convertible with all of the maintenance problems.

I found out the sunroof has four drains on it. Instead of making the sunroof watertight, which is apparently beyond modern science, they have little troughs around it, and water runs from the troughs into rubber hoses with something like a 1/4" ID. The hoses go down through the body, and water pours out under the car.

Because the hoses are so small, they can get clogged up with tree pollen. Sounds like a joke, but it's true. Then you have to blow them out with compressed air. To blow out the front lines, you literally have to stand on your nice leather seats with your head out of the sunroof. The inlets can't be reached with human fingers, so you have to find a way to poke wet paper towels around them with a stick or something in order to seal around your compressed air implement. Otherwise, the air blows back at you.

When water comes into the headliner, it kills the roof motors. Ford put the motors in an area where standing water accumulates. NICE WORK!

To fix the problem, you have to detach the front of the headliner and pull it down. To do this, you have to remove the A-pillar covers. Guess what? They're not made to be reattached. You might get lucky and get them to work, but Ford expects you to spend over a hundred dollars each for new ones.

Guess what you pay to get this problem fixed by a dealer. Over $400. And it can recur.

Here's more fun: the inlets for the rear drain lines can't be accessed without removing the rear sunroof window, which is sealed in place. Your only hope is that blowing the lines out from the rear will clear them.

Again, not a marketing blunder. Engineers chose those tiny lines and put them where they are.

[liveaboard]

Seal it up with sikaflex.
My 'new' car, a 1998 Mercedes, has a sunroof; miraculously, it doesn't leak.
I have never opened it and have no plans to do so in future.


Is there Sikaflex in the US?

[NP317]

"Is there Sikaflex in the US?"

Yes. I just acquired some for restoration work on my 50+ year-old steam launch.
RN

[spro]

First I have to thank Mr. Ron for his great post 3/30/19. I don't know how I missed it. Very insightful and worth reading.
Re: sunroofs, I've only had one in an earlier car. The car was new and had decent undercoating. The way they designed the trough and drain tube, was that it exited from a hole under the spare tire. This hole dripped upon the equivalent of a Panhard rod locating the rear axle. That water drip ate it out and not something to notice when cornering.

[spro]

Further, to Steve G's post, That sounds many ways terrible and a warning. A friend of mine is building a high performance street/ track Mustang. He has built all the roll cages and special fuel cells, protection one can think of. The body had a sunroof. He ( carefully to great measure ) welded a steel plate to replace it. He knew, as has been known that the roof is a primary member to the body structure.

[rrnut-2]

We had one Volvo that had a sunroof. When the drain hoses plugged, the water would leak out and run down the back of the drivers neck. That cured us of sunroofs!

Jim B

[spro]

I suppose they were fun for a while. Then obsolescence crept in. Is there a "perfect" world where pollen and dirty tree debris doesn't happen? It all has to go that way and murdering trees isn't the answer. We are merely in their way and see it closer now.

[liveaboard]

I rode a motorbike as my main transport for most of my life. I liked it and all; fast, cuts through traffic, easy to park, efficient, cheap.
To me the good part about cars is they have a quiet, clean, controlled climate inside. And a roof to keep the sun off my head.
Convertibles and sunroofs don't square with that.

[SteveHGraham]

I have another beauty.

Windows 10 decided to deactivate my network adaptor without notice or explanation. This meant I could not connect to the Internet. I needed a new driver. I tried the feeble Windows help stuff. It said to click a button...so Windows could search the INTERNET.

It gets better. The adaptor is a D-Link. Nothing to worry about! D-Link has a file full of drivers. Every conceivable D-Link adaptor ever made was listed.

Except mine.

Installed the driver for the model for the next-closest model number, and suddenly, my adaptor worked, However, Windows Device Manager says the other model, which now shows up in Device Manager even though it isn't there, will not function.

[warmstrong1955]

First.....: https://www.askwoody.com
Read up.
Next....I have shut off automatic updates. I did that a few years ago, after my printer quit working after an update, and then a bigger plotter as well. That, and I was sick of that stupid pop-up window from Microsoft, telling me to download and install Windows 10.

Since then, I don't install any updates, until ol' Woody says it's OK. (Refer to his Defcon system) Generally, I install a month behind, but before 'MS patch Tuesday....so long as it's clear. Been a few times, it was two months. Takes MS a bit, to change their updates, where they don't wreak havoc on some peoples stuff....drivers, software, and anti-virus's included.

It's a good website. Has links to articles in Computer World, where he gives more detailed info.
All in all a pain in the posterior....but better than having stuff crash, or fail to function.

[SteveHGraham]

It is ASTOUNDING that Microsoft is this inept. You could take a computer to a remote location, intending to rely on it there, and then lose your ability to use the Internet due to a ridiculous update. You could be snowed in and cut off from civilization, unable to use your computer to reach people. I wonder if anyone has died because an update left them stranded.

Thanks for the website suggestion.

[John Hasler]

SteveHGraham writes:
> It is ASTOUNDING that Microsoft is this inept.

They don't need to be ept, since almost everyone believes that they have no choice but to use Microsoft software no matter how bad it is. Most people also don't know how bad it is, having never seen anything else.

> I wonder if anyone has died because an update left them stranded.

Read their terms of service. They make it abundantly clear that their software should not be used for anything that matters.


BTW this is in the wrong thread. Microsoft employs no engineers: just programmers.