Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

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gnsteam
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Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:58 pm
Location: Lincoln, NE

Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by gnsteam »

I purchased a used 1324 Granite machine about ten years ago. I think it was built new in the late nineties. The machine sees very little use (8-40 hours a year) and is in great condition. However for the second time in the last three years, I have lost (burned out) the motor control board, when turning large diameter work pieces at low rpm. My Granite does not have the optional two pulley drive for lower speed operation.
Here is my questions? Have any of you experienced this problem? Have you upgraded you machine to the duel pulley system for lower speed operation and did this help. I talked with Smithy support and they suggested two options for me to consider for upgrades to my Granite.
Option 1; Replace 1.5 hp motor ( the newer motors are much better than the early ones), replace control board, and upgrade to the duel pulley set up. Cost approx. $523.00
Option 2; Upgrade to a the new 2 hp brush less motor with controller. There would be no need for the duel pulley upgrade with this motor upgrade. Cost approx. $700.00.
Have any of you upgraded or have purchased a new granite with the 2 hp brush less motor, and how does it preform over the original motor/controller?

Or are there any other options out there that I might consider.

Thanks

Fred
Fred
toddalin
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Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by toddalin »

Does the Granite run on 110 and if so, can your breakers support 2 hp? My ShopMaster has 1.5 hp, 110 motors and when the spindle bearings were binding, that additional draw was enough to continually trip my breaker until I had the bearings changed.

You may want to look into the amperage draw before you commit.
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gnsteam
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Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by gnsteam »

Good advice. It is 110v, and it is only a 20 amp circuit.

Thanks

Fred
Fred
Torch
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Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by Torch »

gnsteam wrote:I purchased a used 1324 Granite machine about ten years ago. I think it was built new in the late nineties. The machine sees very little use (8-40 hours a year) and is in great condition. However for the second time in the last three years, I have lost (burned out) the motor control board, when turning large diameter work pieces at low rpm. My Granite does not have the optional two pulley drive for lower speed operation.
Here is my questions? Have any of you experienced this problem? Have you upgraded you machine to the duel pulley system for lower speed operation and did this help. I talked with Smithy support and they suggested two options for me to consider for upgrades to my Granite.
Option 1; Replace 1.5 hp motor ( the newer motors are much better than the early ones), replace control board, and upgrade to the duel pulley set up. Cost approx. $523.00
Option 2; Upgrade to a the new 2 hp brush less motor with controller. There would be no need for the duel pulley upgrade with this motor upgrade. Cost approx. $700.00.
Have any of you upgraded or have purchased a new granite with the 2 hp brush less motor, and how does it preform over the original motor/controller?
When I first got my machine (not a Granite, but similar in design), I burned out the controller board a couple of times before I discovered there was a short in one of the motor windings (poor Chinese quality control).

Now, by "dual pulley", may I assume you mean a large/small on the motor and a small/large on the headstock, giving 2 speed ranges? That's what I have and I generally leave it in the low speed range unless I have a specific need for high speed. There is no debate that the low range provides better torque at low speeds, and I have no doubt at all that the same would apply to a brushless motor. It's simple: a small pulley on the motor coupled with a larger pulley on the headstock multiplies the motor's torque. I have a 1.5hp motor and can sometimes stall it when turning large diameters at slow speed.

As for the controller, a PWM controller is far superior for low speed torque (and cool, quiet running with extended motor life) compared to an SCR controller. If you are going to lay out that kind of cash, I'd see what kind of controller they are offering and consider the aftermarket if they are supplying an SCR controller.
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gnsteam
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:58 pm
Location: Lincoln, NE

Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by gnsteam »

Torch wrote:
gnsteam wrote:I purchased a used 1324 Granite machine about ten years ago. I think it was built new in the late nineties. The machine sees very little use (8-40 hours a year) and is in great condition. However for the second time in the last three years, I have lost (burned out) the motor control board, when turning large diameter work pieces at low rpm. My Granite does not have the optional two pulley drive for lower speed operation.
Here is my questions? Have any of you experienced this problem? Have you upgraded you machine to the duel pulley system for lower speed operation and did this help. I talked with Smithy support and they suggested two options for me to consider for upgrades to my Granite.
Option 1; Replace 1.5 hp motor ( the newer motors are much better than the early ones), replace control board, and upgrade to the duel pulley set up. Cost approx. $523.00
Option 2; Upgrade to a the new 2 hp brush less motor with controller. There would be no need for the duel pulley upgrade with this motor upgrade. Cost approx. $700.00.
Have any of you upgraded or have purchased a new granite with the 2 hp brush less motor, and how does it preform over the original motor/controller?
When I first got my machine (not a Granite, but similar in design), I burned out the controller board a couple of times before I discovered there was a short in one of the motor windings (poor Chinese quality control).

Now, by "dual pulley", may I assume you mean a large/small on the motor and a small/large on the headstock, giving 2 speed ranges? That's what I have and I generally leave it in the low speed range unless I have a specific need for high speed. There is no debate that the low range provides better torque at low speeds, and I have no doubt at all that the same would apply to a brushless motor. It's simple: a small pulley on the motor coupled with a larger pulley on the headstock multiplies the motor's torque. I have a 1.5hp motor and can sometimes stall it when turning large diameters at slow speed.

As for the controller, a PWM controller is far superior for low speed torque (and cool, quiet running with extended motor life) compared to an SCR controller. If you are going to lay out that kind of cash, I'd see what kind of controller they are offering and consider the aftermarket if they are supplying an SCR controller.
My Granite does have the high and low speed pulleys as you described. I actually mis-described the duel pulley system upgrade that Smithy is recommending. The upgrade adds a duel idler pulley (of two different diameters) in between the motor and spindle pulley. Thus changing the set up to a two drive belt set up, giving you an even lower speed range and making the original low range a mid range speed. there is a diagram of this set up on pages 67-69 of the Granite operating manual, available on the Smithy web site.

Thanks for the information about the difference in controllers. I'm no electrical expert so recommendations are welcomed. Did you convert to a PWM controller?

Fred
Fred
Torch
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Location: Muskoka

Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by Torch »

Yes. Actually, I converted to two PWM controllers, one for each motor. Now I can use the lathe motor as a mill powerfeed ;-)

I have 180v motors, so I used the KBWT-210. I think there's a thread about the conversion around here somewhere.

One thing: the ones I bought are considerably larger than the Chinese SCR controller that came with the machine. I added an electrical box to the side of the stand to house the controllers and rewired things to suit.
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gnsteam
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Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:58 pm
Location: Lincoln, NE

Re: Motor upgrade for Smithy Granite 1324

Post by gnsteam »

Torch wrote:Yes. Actually, I converted to two PWM controllers, one for each motor. Now I can use the lathe motor as a mill powerfeed ;-)

I have 180v motors, so I used the KBWT-210. I think there's a thread about the conversion around here somewhere.

One thing: the ones I bought are considerably larger than the Chinese SCR controller that came with the machine. I added an electrical box to the side of the stand to house the controllers and rewired things to suit.
Torch,

I did find your thread about your PWM upgrade, very informative. I did some testing tonight, per Smithy tech support instructions. I found that the controller (SCR) is ok, and that the motor is bad. So now do I purchase a replacement from Smithy or source one on my own, looking for an American made motor. So It's off to the web to search.

Thanks

Fred
Fred
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