Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

This forum is dedicated to those hobbyists with the 3-in-1 metalworking machines. Mill-Drill-Lathes. Tips, techniques, modification and use of these machines is topical.

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Torch
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Location: Muskoka

Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by Torch »

Sorry, I had grandkids over yesterday and didn't have time for correspondence.

I don't have a lot of pics with me, but here's a couple, anyway.

The machine as originally delivered, with the addition of the DRO:

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The PWM controller upgrade:

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Added separate controls for the mill (speed and reverse):

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I don't think this detail of my compound mod was in the link I gave you earlier:

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An couple of shots of my workspace. The little tool cart has since been replaced by a 48" wide roller cabinet, and the optical comparator has since been relocated to make room for a second wood machinists chest all to accommodate the growing collection of machine tooling:

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Unfortunately, I don't have a photo of my table gib adjustment fix. Basically all I did was replace both sets of 732 and 733 with a long bolt with lock nut. I think I turned the end of the bolt so it wouldn't mushroom any threads where it contacts the gib and slotted the other end for a screwdriver. The nut simply tightens against the casting face to lock the adjustment. Now the adjuster can be held in place while being locked. The original always moved slightly when the "locking" setscrew was tightened.
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

Whoa!!! That's really a nice machine! I really like the DRO and the speed controls. Did your machine come with variable speed for the mill and lathe? Is the upgrade of the PWM to control added DC motors or did it come with those motors? I don't recall seeing a 3-In-One, Chinese style like ours, come equipped with variable speed. What is the branded name of your 3-In-One? I see a computer on the pic's left side and wondering if it is part of your system to control everything. (Are we talking about your being a CNC modded system?) What ever it is "I LIKE IT" and am really amazed at what you have done!

I almost forgot to ask what that grey "alien" looking equipment on the bench? So many questing and so little time! LoL
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

For now I just want to keep mine simple. Got rid of a CNC machine I never wanted to learn to use and not have something more useable for my small needs. Who knows what I will want to do in the future when/if my machinist skills and needs become a necessity. Right now I'm just having fun learning about my new toy and bugging forum people for information that is sometimes very apparent to the skilled.
Torch
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by Torch »

The machine is is an HQ800V, made by Chinzou Household Machine Tool company of China. It is my understanding that they are the factory that makes many of the housebrand 3-in-1 machines sold by Grizzly, Busy Bee, Harbor Freight, etc. (I know for sure that the Busy Bee part number for the half-nut is exactly the same as for my machine, and that Grizzly and Busy Bee are owned by brothers who generally use the same suppliers). The factory offers a variety of options that allow the different house brands to differ from each other slightly. For example, I think it was the Northern Tools version that had the quick change gear box. I ordered it from the factory (through Machine Tools Warehouse), cherry picking the options that I wanted instead of settling for the options offered by a particular house brand.

The 180v, 1.5hp DC motors were part of the variable speed option. It came with a single SCR based controller and a switch to select either the lathe motor or the mill motor. I swapped that out for a pair of PWM controllers, one dedicated to each motor, and added a second potentiometer and reverse switch for the mill. This allows me to use the lathe motor as a mill powerfeed.

The laptop is not connected to the machine in any way. It's just there for reference works. EG: an electronic copy of Machinery's Handbook, various thread pitch programs, etc. It's so old and slow I avoid using the Handbook because it's faster to go in the house and look something up than wait for it to load on that old laptop! So mostly it just gets used to look up thread dimensions.

"grey "alien" looking equipment"? I'm guessing you mean the Micro-Vu MV-400 optical comparator beside the wood tool chest? A handy piece of equipment, it blows up a shadow of the piece under examination 20x life size on screen (also has a side-light to highlight surface details).

The accuracy is caliper-class not micrometer-class, but it is very useful for measuring things that are difficult to impossible to determine by other means. That includes angles and radii. Probably the single most common use I make of it is in the grinding of form tools for the lathe. I can accurately make a 60° threading tool, with the correct flat for the root, or achieve the correct width and radius for an o-ring groove tool. It is also useful for identifying an existing thread. For example, one time I needed to replicate a bolt with what looked like a 1/4"-28 thread -- but a 1/4"-28 wouldn't fit. A thread pitch gauge confirmed the pitch and a mic confirmed the diameter was slightly undersized, but it still wouldn't fit. With the optical comparator, I could see the rounded crests and roots and measure the 55° flank angle and from that I discovered it was something called "sewing machine thread". I ground a tool to suit and made my bolts.

Here it is in action. First, just the profile (shadow):

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Now, let's add some detail with the side light:

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Here's more of an overview:

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I picked it up on eBay for $50, on the recommendation of Glenn. Shipping was another $40. Of course, at that price it was old and dirty and the projector lamp was obsolete, so I cleaned it and modded it with a very powerful LED mounted on a large copper heat-sink. The original lamp:

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and my mod:

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That cost as much as the delivered price of the OC, but should last forever.

A number of guys are using a modern alternative: a cheap USB microscope camera and an old laptop. But pick a slightly newer/faster version than the Toshiba Brick you were admiring above, OK? :lol:
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ken572
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by ken572 »

LX Kid wrote:For now I just want to keep mine simple. Got rid of a CNC machine I never wanted to learn to use and not have something more useable for my small needs. Who knows what I will want to do in the future when/if my machinist skills and needs become a necessity. Right now I'm just having fun learning about my new toy and bugging forum people for information that is sometimes very apparent to the skilled.
Good Morning :!: LX :D

There is nothing wrong with simple :wink:
I believe if we learn to enjoy ourselves and take
our time learning and becoming skilled with the
basic manual tools, and machines, and equipment
first, that if and when we find the need to learn and
use the faster automated equipment, we will become
very successful much quicker because of our hard
work learning manual skill's well, first.
Most important of all, is we are at a time in our lives
where enjoying SLOW and LOW TECH is or
can be very rewarding and relaxing. 8) JMHO.
Ken. :)
One must remember.
The best learning experiences come
from working with the older Masters.
Ken.
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

I worked on the apron gib today. The two screws, not the lock screws, had flat spots on them. Rounded and smoothed the two screws that adjust the gib tension and was able to get much smother operation which took the "slop" out of the table play. Still waiting for my gear and half nut to come in. Maybe tomorrow.
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

I really don't like using the various carbide inserts. It seems that I just don't use them properly to get the cut/finnish that I want. It's my understanding they have to be used at higher speeds, and I have tried, but not getting very good results. Might be that I am not getting inserts that have tip contour that I need. (Too sharp point.) I ordered some HSS cutter steel to start learning how to form and sharpen them.
Torch
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by Torch »

The issue is probably not just speed, but also rigidity of the machine. I've no experience with big heavy lathes, or inserts, but this is what I have read here on this board.

Carbide generally uses a negative rake -- pushing the metal off rather than shearing it off. So the machine must be very sturdy to counter the higher forces. Any vibration is going to show up in the surface finish. This will be even more obvious with harder metals than softer metals.

Now, what I have done with reasonable success is to grind brazed carbide tool bits to a positive rake. It either cuts very well, or it chips off. But it has allowed me to take shallow cuts on very hard materials when needed.

Generally, I grind my own M42 (8% cobalt) HSS bits. More expensive than regular HSS, but good wear and high-heat performance and much tougher than carbide.
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

Torch wrote:The issue is probably not just speed, but also rigidity of the machine. I've no experience with big heavy lathes, or inserts, but this is what I have read here on this board.

Carbide generally uses a negative rake -- pushing the metal off rather than shearing it off. So the machine must be very sturdy to counter the higher forces. Any vibration is going to show up in the surface finish. This will be even more obvious with harder metals than softer metals.
Now, what I have done with reasonable success is to grind brazed carbide tool bits to a positive rake. It either cuts very well, or it chips off. But it has allowed me to take shallow cuts on very hard materials when needed.
Generally, I grind my own M42 (8% cobalt) HSS bits. More expensive than regular HSS, but good wear and high-heat performance and much tougher than carbide.
Just wondering, if they are brazed on then how can you change it to a positive rake? Would you have to add a shim under the front of the tool holder to raise the tip upward? Thanks
Torch
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by Torch »

I regrind them into a positive rake.
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

My parts came in the mail this morning and I reassembled the parts into the lathe. "Crappy Parts!" The gear w/shaft was also just as rough made as the first one without the rust. I also had to drill my own roll pin hole! Looks like they take a small chisel and bang away to make the teeth. When I place the gear onto the rack it looks like a mismatch with lots of slop. I took a triangular file and wrapped some 240 paper around and worked on each tooth valley to smooth it out somewhat.

If there is someone reading this, that has gear making experience, I'd be willing to pay them to make me a proper gear. The old one appears to be a press on and the new one looks to be made from one piece of bar stock. I have a dividing head and will try my hand at making one and see how it goes. I've not used it yet and this will certainly be a "big" learning curve for me. Just gotta figure out what kind of cutter I'll need to put on my 1" cutter arbor. I also got in the mail today books on Dividing head use and gear cutting. (Lot's of reading.)
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LX Kid
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Re: Getting my new G9729 Grizzly up running! Help

Post by LX Kid »

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