The Home Machinist!

Hi,
I'm ultra new to the world of machining (long time fan though) and was hoping to hear what your opinion about some 3-in-1 machines I'm considering to buy are.

I'm mostly interested in Mill/Drill/Lathes because I only have a 1 car garage with a car project taking up most of it already... along with a ton of other equipment (e.g. welder, compressor, cabinets, etc.).

I've found some entry level machines for starters; specifically the Grizzly [G9729] and Smithy [Midas 1220 LTD]. Both are at the top of my price range. Is there any preference over one from the other? Any other machine manufacturers you prefer... why?

Anyway, it's nice to be here and I hope to hear what you think.

—Chaz

I have the Smithy 1220 LTD. You can read my thought's on this machine by running a search under my user name. I think this is the best 3 in 1 machine for the size and the $'s available + Smithy support and accessory's are all together on there web site. If you need more information or photos of an actual working 1220 LTD and accessories, please feel free to contact me at kgowe@comcast.net

Best? The Golmatic (Google it) would surely be near the top of the list. But the price will be around $20,000 with one fully equipped for milling, drilling, turning, indexing . . .

Affordable best? Maybe a used Austrian-made Emco Maximat in good condition.

Like I said above..........the best value for the $'s spent............

I have an older ShopTask, that I bought used, and it give me all the accuracy I need for my home hobby work. I really like it and it compliments my Grizzly G0619 SX3.

Greetings from another newby to the forum.

I found this thread and thought I would join in cuz I have the same questions.

The boss (spouse) has given the go ahead for the purchase of a metal lathe (waits for the cheering and applause to die down) and I have been looking at the Grizzly units.

I have read and been told by those more knowledgeable than I that you should stay away form the lathe/mill combos as they do neither operation very well. The question begs to be asked. Why not? Does the weight of the mill throw off the ways slightly or are there other technical issues that need to be explored?

Any ideas / thoughts / suggestions / observations / personal experiences would be appreciated.

Thanks for reading and have a great autumn evening.

Mike

PS: By the way, the Grizzly [G9729] is no longer carried by them.

There's 3-in-1s and then there's 3-in-1s. Some are pretty small and flimsy, but I think the 9729 style is one of the better ones around. I don't think even the critics have a problem with the lathe portion, per se. It's comparable to any Chinese lathe of similar size. There are two main criticisms, the first being the need of swapping set-ups when switching from milling to drilling.

To a degree, this is warranted. If I have something on the lathe, I can't readily set up something else for milling or drilling. I find this primarily happens when I have a project I am pecking away at in my spare time, but need to use the machine for something more urgent in the meantime. I can sometimes go the other way -- use the lathe for a quick job without disturbing the mill set up too much by mounting the tool post further to the end of the table than usual. It depends on how much of the table is already in use for the milling project.

Interruptions aside, changing from one job to another generally involves a new set-up on any machine so that particular characteristic is not that much of an impediment otherwise. I can often plan the job so all lathe work is done at one time and all mill work done at a separate time. I'll even do multiple projects simultaneously that way. For example, when I made some gears, I turned the blanks for the gears and the gear cutter etc. all at the same time, then set up to mill -- first the cutter, then the gears using the cutter.

The other complaint is that the mill/drill moves when the head is raised or lowered due to the round column. This is common to any round-column mill-drill, not just 3-in-1 machines. There are ways around this, it just takes some time and care to re-index and some forethought to ensure you have something to index to before and after raising/lowering the column. Many 3-in-1 designs have a fair bit of space between the table and the spindle, even when the column is fully lowered. There is a temptation to rely on the quill as there is no movable knee, but accuracy suffers at full quill extension. It is better to use a riser block to lift the work or a different tool holder to lower the tool rather than fully extend the quill when milling. BTW: When considering the practical limitations of the other two dimensions, remember that while the cross-slide travel may be, say, 8-1/2", you have to leave some room for the diameter of the tool at either end.

Size-wise, the 3-in-1 format has the obvious advantage of a smaller footprint than two separate machines of the same individual capability. This was a huge consideration in my case, where I could only spare a small corner of the garage. Separate machines would have meant much smaller machines, so in my particular case, the "small-envelope" of the 3-in-1 is actually larger than I could achieve with separate machines.

Cost-wise, the 3-in-1 can have an advantage too. The lathe uses the milling table to support the tool post, there's only one bed to build, a single 3-axis DRO does double duty (with a quick setting change from Radius to Diameter mode on the cross slide, of course) and the lathe motor can be a power-feed for milling (on machines with separate motors anyway). A side-effect of mounting the lathe tool post on a milling table is that there's room to have two tool posts set up at the same time -- handy for making a series of ball-ends or whatever. (And if you are doing small stuff, you can have a milling vice at one end of the table and a tool post on the other -- so much for the "have to change set-ups" criticism )

So if space and money are no object, time is critical and/or you will regularly mill across more than 6-8" in each direction or deeper than 4", then the 3-in-1 format is probably not for you. But I have turned out some quite usable pieces over the last 1-1/2 years so if the versatile format "fits" you and your needs, don't be afraid just because some others decided a 3-in-1 didn't fit them.

Thanks for the detailed response. Is there any difference between the units where the mill is mounted midway down the ways versus those where it is mounted above the main motor housing - other than mountain location of course.

Also, would it be beneficial to get a unit where a part could be turned and milled at the same time or are the lower cost units capable of doing that?

I've never had the opportunity to examine one of those mid-ship mounted mills close up. There may be an advantage in rigidity, as the overhanging arm doesn't have to clear the lathe spindle and could possibly be shorter. Of course, that would only apply if the construction is equally heavy, which is probably not the case with separate add-on milling accessories for standard lathes. I don't know how the available table size and travel would compare.



I am not aware of any machine with that capability (outside of CNC). I suspect it would be difficult or dangerous to apply a spinning milling cutter to a spinning workpiece by hand! That said, I have used the lathe chuck & tailstock to hold a piece while drilling it -- a fast and easy way to locate a hole on-centre of a round shaft.

That said, having separate lathe and mill motors is useful for milling operations. The better machines have thread-cutting capability, meaning they have a feed screw geared to the lathe spindle. That feed screw is intended to move the tool post (either left-right or in-out). Since carriage does double duty as both the mount for the toolpost and as the milling table, the lathe motor can therefore be used as a power feed when milling. Two caveats: first, even if you remove the chuck, there is still a spinning lathe spindle to be aware of. Second, some machines (like mine) have a selector switch instead of separate lathe & mill power switches. Those have to be re-wired to allow running both motors simultaneously.

Some good points - which once again proves that a person can learn something new every day. ;p)

I did see a you tube video where a guy was using a lathe/mill combo in conjunction to machine some sort of flange. I could see where utmost care would be required though during the operation.

Thanks again for the detailed response.

Mike