Allen Models needs votes.

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SZuiderveen
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by SZuiderveen »

dwilloughby wrote:I vote #2. The Hitchcocks in Riverside have the second one built originally for Ted Steinmentz of Oakland. Mel and Mike found it in an antique store and did a great job of restoration.
Would that be this loco I saw at Riverside in October of 2015?
Second Allen 4-4-0
Second Allen 4-4-0
Regards,

Steve
Steve Alley
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by Steve Alley »

Well I see it trending to the American more, But what if the American drawings came with dome style of both and the front end both drawings. Head light and stack both too. In other words you will get the short American to do in 1910-1940 and 1865-1880 all in one set. win win for all. Yes the cost of drawing will be more but it will be all there. The frame may or may not be water jet cut. Do to the look and cost. If this does take off, I would look at the frame to offered. My big cost is the pattern work, This is way I am asking. to develop the dome castings is the biggie. I have a idea for the stack, to be punch out leaves. Two dies. top die and bottom die. with over lapping seams. Head light not sure yet. Like to make a die for it to form the four sides and top. Casting would be a lot cheaper for it but the weight of cast Iron on hangers and hang out so far is a issue to the braces or mounts. No not Alu. I am done with that material. My brass foundry does Alu and we are doing a test run on the running boards. No other material will come out decent. Plan on it though. OK lets see what this ends up on the votes. I can tell you this the 2-4-0 is going to happen. The drawings are being scan now and work to change all the fractions to Decimal will happen soon. Note all the castings for the 2-4-0 is on hand as we speak. Side Elevation drawing looks really nice.
Thank You very much people
Steve Alley
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BAdams
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by BAdams »

Steve,

Here are a couple pics of the Hitchcock American:
April 27_174_sm.JPG
April 27_116_sm.JPG

Brook
Pontiacguy1
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by Pontiacguy1 »

The Steinmetz locomotive in the above photos is actually the VERY first 4-4-0 built using Gene's casting that anyone is aware of. From what I've been told, it was basically a Mogul without the front drive wheel set and a 4 wheel lead truck added in place of the 2 wheel pony truck. Not a bad looking locomotive, I might add, and probably a good performer too. No doubt it precedes the locomotive I was referencing by several years, being built sometime in the 1970's if my memory serves me correctly.

What I am saying is that the locomotive built by Gene Allen and delivered to Mr. Pickard in 1983 represents the first 4-4-0 built from Gene's 4-4-0 specific designs and castings. Thus it has the 8 1/2" diameter square counterweight drivers, the jam brakes between the drivers, the rear driver moved back several inches up under the cab, the simulated wood cab castings, steam dome moved back right against the cab, Narrowed cylinders with the main rod on the inside, and probably a few more things. It was the first locomotive to have these features and really was the prototype. Gene's own personal locomotive, his 4-4-0 which appears in the catalog, is the second one that he built, and it has the longer main rod and is more stretched out.

I like the look of the shorter locomotive better. I am actually making my locomotives 3" shorter than the catalog locomotive, but 2" longer than the Pickard locomotive pictured earlier. That's just because it is more in keeping with the dimensions of a locomotive in a photo that I'm trying to copy somewhat.

That's the beauty of the Allen Models castings and plans... They lend themselves to be kitbashed and adapted for other projects quite nicely.
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johnpenn74
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by johnpenn74 »

I will second the Scotts suggestion for the short wheel base 4-4-0 based on the mogul main rod.

I would also like to throw in two cents on what a fast first build the 4-4-0 is. There are several things that make this a easier build than the 4-6-0, side rods, reduced braking components (jam brakes) Forward frame is a bar not over complex casting, etc. In my view the 4 wheel lead truck puts this engine in the ROAD category. Granted it is not a 4-8-4, but I think it is the quickest build for a mainline engine (as opposed to a 0-4-0 or similar.)

I do recommend that some time be spent reworking the design, specifically the suspension. Loose the fake leaf springs, spring the rear axle, rock the leafs over the saddle, simplfy the underframe equlizer;

And while we're at it, make an ashpan door arrangement that doesn't require two forceps to open and close.

All the cast iron castings in the world won't make up for the fact that the design has not been tweaked in 30 years. I sorta don't understand this, as the original 4-4-0 engine that scott rebuilt actally had most of these problems resolved, real leafs. Having spent some time reworking my Allen 4-4-0 and 4-6-0 in the last few year I will say the simplifications of the suspention are a detriment and should be addressed. My 4-4-0 appeared to be built to print, however was so slippery that the safeties have been dropped to 100#. One way to solve the problem,... not the right way.

Please consider selling the 4-4-0 and 4-6-0 drawings as single set, most of the drawings are the same anyways. If I was building one tomorrow I would build a 10 with the 4-4-0 forward frame.

JP
John Pennington

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Project
2 Mich-Cal Shays
Allen 4-4-0 Narrow Gauge Conversion
Two Reading A5a Camelback 0-4-0
USRA 0-6-0
Clishay
4 Western Wheeled Scraper NG Dump Cars
N&W 4-8-2
ICM 2-10-2
4 Modern Stake Cars
L&N Caboose
4 Big Four Conversion Gondolas

Like I'm actually gonna build all this stuff :-P
Steve Alley
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by Steve Alley »

Well we are working on the new or old 2-4-0 Harpur engine and add this to the list of engines avalible. Soon it will be on the web site. But its the short American that going to take time. One new patterns need for this to look the 1860 to 1880 look. Domes, stack, headlight, pilot or cow catcher, Just a few of what is needed. Please I still need votes and see what the interest is. Not enough interest then I will move on and come back later, many years later. So Vote please. Steve Alley
Moron
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by Moron »

Personally, I would rather see an Allen 2-8-2 or a heavier 2-8-0. But between the 2, short framed 4-4-0 is my vote
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rwmorris
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by rwmorris »

Marty_Knox
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Re: Allen Models needs votes.

Post by Marty_Knox »

That is Keith Muldowney's 4-4-0, with one of my boilers.
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