Turbo generators?

For the Buying/Selling/Trading of items of interest to those of us in the Live Steam Hobby.

Moderators: Harold_V, WJH, gwrdriver

User avatar
makinsmoke
Posts: 1851
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:56 pm
Location: Texas Hill Country

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by makinsmoke » Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:48 pm

I'd be willing to be that the majority of the money is in the guts.

Making a lost-wax casting of a dummy turbo is not rocket science.

Building a working turbo generator turning 10,000 rpm plus is another thing entirely, ugly or otherwise.

There is a neat article in a past Live Steam where someone built one up from scratch. Read it and you'll see what I mean.

I'd like to have one too, as well as a couple of Nathan injectors. However, at 1400 a pop, I am just glad my prototype has the injectors in the cab.
I'll stick a couple of Economy's in there and wait patiently for a turbo....

I mean, I still need a boiler, as well as other critical items....
Brian

Howard Gorin
Posts: 275
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:56 am
Location: Waltham, MA

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Howard Gorin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:16 am

In fact there are a lot of costs.
There are four major investment castings.
There are more smaller castings, I am not sure how many. I would have to count.
In the past year the cost of investment casting has doubled. My primary investment casting foundry has closed and i am trying to build a relation with a new supplier.
There is machining of the parts, including drilling and tapping 00-90 holes and threading 00-90 toggle bolts.
To make a working turbogenerator means adding a turbine wheel, a generating component, a steam seal, a steam nozzle, and a pressure or voltage regulator.
I think Francis Moseley built them to keep himself active in retirement, Taking his sale price and adjusting for costs then and now he did not make any money building them.
There are items made today that were not available when Francis Moseley made his turbines, If I can utilize these items it may make for some cost reductions and a more reliable turbogenerator.

User avatar
makinsmoke
Posts: 1851
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 12:56 pm
Location: Texas Hill Country

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by makinsmoke » Tue Aug 23, 2011 7:58 am

What can we do to help Howard?

User avatar
Doug_Edwards
Posts: 587
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2003 8:06 pm
Location: No. Idaho
Contact:

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Doug_Edwards » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:10 am

Howard Gorin wrote:In fact there are a lot of costs.

I think Francis Moseley built them to keep himself active in retirement, Taking his sale price and adjusting for costs then and now he did not make any money building them.
I visited Francis Moselely after the Westec show in 1980. He said at that point what he charged for the generators covered basically the materials, not the labor to build them.

Regards,

Doug
http://www.precisionlocomotivecastings.com/
Building a 70 ton Willamette in 1.6"
Building a 80 ton Climax in 1.6"

"Aim to improve!"
"Mine is not to question why, mine is just to tool and die"

Howard Gorin
Posts: 275
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:56 am
Location: Waltham, MA

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Howard Gorin » Tue Aug 23, 2011 9:13 am

The last person who wanted to help me out wanted to know who let me in!
Among other things on my plate. Head lights and turbogenerators
Nathan and Detroit lubricators, Westinghouse CC air pumps.
Get my 1922 Buffalo-Springfield steam roller through a state boiler inspection.,
Learn Solidworks, Mastercam. Autocad... The list goes on.
Including get two Linotype machines working for a museum.
Anybody want to paint a steam roller?
Last time I looked there were three rollers in the barn.
Now I only claim ownership of two of them, one belongs to the Waushakum live steamers.
Anybody want to work on the two smaller ones, they are little machines, only 8 tons each.

Mountaineer
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:45 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Mountaineer » Tue Aug 23, 2011 1:59 pm

Does anyone know who makes working turbogenerators for 2 1/2" scale engines?

Thanks,
Mountaineer.

User avatar
Loco112
Posts: 942
Joined: Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:09 pm
Location: Dallas ,Texas. USA

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Loco112 » Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:41 am

Tom Miller had them made at one time.
Narrow Gauge (Information) Exchange dot Org forum
My Projects:
Davenport 30 ton diesel (SV#101 / D&RGW#50)
C&S 1908 steel & 1905 wood: box, stock, flat, gon
D&RGW wooden freight cars, long & short cabeese
EBT 2-bay hoppers, Conoco #44 tank
DV (K&J) hopper
8"n3 - 3-footers, 8" scale, 24" gauge

User avatar
Jim_Nolan
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 11:03 am
Location: UK, North of the wall
Contact:

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Jim_Nolan » Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:46 am

The 2.5” question came up before in 2010 from with this YouTube link to Midwest although following the web address comes up blank now





Dnc systems in Australia make a K240 in 2” scale

Jim
www.northernsteam.com

User avatar
PRR5406
Posts: 653
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 7:12 pm
Location: Eastern Maine

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by PRR5406 » Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:17 pm

Suppose you take a good quality 12 volt DC motor out of an old tape recorder, place a wheel on it and build a container from copper tubing. Seal off one end with an insulated piece, then pass steam through a contained chamber. Would that work, in theory? In practice?
"Always stopping my train, and risking my ankles, with American made, New Balance sneakers."

Howard Gorin
Posts: 275
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 2:56 am
Location: Waltham, MA

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Howard Gorin » Wed Aug 24, 2011 2:02 pm

In theory yes, in practice proabably not well or long.
The turbine wheel will be spinning 20,000-30,000 R.P.M.
Consumer grade motor bearings will not last long, but would
probably out last the brushes and commutator.
There are better ways, I hope to build a turbogenerator.
I will not criticize you for trying

mjahn
Posts: 405
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 1:38 am
Contact:

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by mjahn » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:37 pm

Its almost tempting to strap peltiers to the underside of the boiler, run warm led's everywhere you need light, and rig up a dummy generator so it exhausts steam and see what hapens. Could even put a fan inside the dummy on bearings so it would "whirl."
Mattaniah Jahn

Matt Corps. Railsystems,
operating on the Manatee Central RR
http://www.flickr.com/photos/62441046@N06/sets/

User avatar
Jim_Nolan
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 11:03 am
Location: UK, North of the wall
Contact:

Re: Turbo generators?

Post by Jim_Nolan » Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:26 am

Mountaineer wrote:Does anyone know who makes working turbogenerators for 2 1/2" scale engines?

Thanks,
Mountaineer.

Further to my last post

My copy of Australian Model Engineer turned up today and I notice in the E. J Winter catalogue they are selling working 2.5 scale Turbo-G’s

http://www.ejwinter.com.au/index.htm

Although this looks like the same Midwest one discussed earlier but you never know he might have some left in stock.

Jim
www.northernsteam.com

Post Reply