Santa Fe reefer

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makinsmoke
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by makinsmoke » Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:10 pm

More paint mask, stencilling...

9th pic - Dab the brush vertically onto the surface. You don't want to pres down, as that will encourage the paint to squeeze under the mask. Keep moving the brush. You want a little at a time all over. You really do not want to cover the first tine around or in one step. You can move on to other masks and let this tack up. I went all the way around and got one coat on everything that needed to be black, then came back to the beginning, where the paint was essentially dry. Repeat as many times (probably no more than two or three) to get decent coverage.
stencil8.jpg
10th pic - Once dry, I use an Xacto to peel the corner up and begin removing the mask. You'll have to go back with an Xacto or pin and remove the void areas not bridged, like the center of a zero, or the two areas inside the figure 8.
stencil10.jpg
11th pic - If you are lucky, you 'll end up with something like this. As you an see, the larger brush I was using got off the mask onto the yellow-orange. No problem, there will be some touch up anyway.
stencil 11.jpg
12th pic - right side dimensional data done.
stencil 12.jpg
13th pic - While I had the black out I also touched up the rivets on the hinges, grabirons, and corner angles. B end.
stencil13.jpg
14th pic - A end, same side. Really starting to feel like I may have the biggest part done.
stencil14.jpg

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Kevin_S
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by Kevin_S » Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:47 pm

Brian, one more trick to get the paint mask to conform to irregularties on the car is to take a hair dryer and heat up the paint mask and with a brush push the mask into the irregularties.
The car is looking Awesome!
-Kevin S.

Rwilliams
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by Rwilliams » Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:53 pm

Brian,

The Santa Fe paint style used on the SFRD reefers like you are building was one of the simple but classic designs that is almost timeless. I always liked that design and seeing it so well executed with the stencil process is food for thought. I may try that process when I get around to painting the caboose. The individual boards will certainly add to the challenge.

I spent most of the summer with a nasty virus that turned into pneumonia. I had almost no energy for over 11 weeks where very little was achieved in the shop. All the tedious jobs like the pattern for the Carmer cut lever fulcrum casting never were touched. I can see where your reefer project could use that style of cut lever based on the build date. I will eventually get back to that project as I still need the same part for the caboose project.

Keep up the nice work,

Robert

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ccvstmr
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by ccvstmr » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:45 pm

Hey Brian,

Thanks for the pictorial explanation of the masking process. The "graphics" really make the car stand out! Are the masks the same kind of vinyl used for the direct application method...just a reverse image?

The use of an elevating track/platform/cart or other is a great back saver too instead of bending over so far for all the steps needed in the lettering and numbering effort. Keep up the good work. What's your next project going to be? Inquiring minds want to know. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!

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Kevin_S
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by Kevin_S » Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:00 pm

Carl, the paint mask is a special low stick vinyl that can be easly removed when you are done. Normal vinyl will leave adhesive residue behind.
-Kevin S.

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FLtenwheeler
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by FLtenwheeler » Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:05 pm

Hi Carl


Take a look here: http://www.chaski.org/homemachinist/vie ... =8&t=80848

Tim



ccvstmr wrote:Hey Brian,

Thanks for the pictorial explanation of the masking process. The "graphics" really make the car stand out! Are the masks the same kind of vinyl used for the direct application method...just a reverse image?

The use of an elevating track/platform/cart or other is a great back saver too instead of bending over so far for all the steps needed in the lettering and numbering effort. Keep up the good work. What's your next project going to be? Inquiring minds want to know. Carl B.
He who dies with the most unfinished projects: Should of put more time into their hobby.

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makinsmoke
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by makinsmoke » Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:58 pm

Thanks Fellas.
I participate in the bi-annual Comanche and Indian Gap Railroad operating sessions in Central Texas.

Roy and Marylin Pickard began this railroad way back in the late 70's - early 80's. It is the first point to point live steam railroad built and designed exclusively for operation, with dispatchers, radios, freight trains, and passenger trains running via timetable.

It takes a great amount of effort nearly year-round to maintain and then prepare the railroad for the runs in the spring and fall. The irregulars provide service from cutting brush, repairing and maintaining right of way and trackage, building and maintaining signals, and servicing and rebuilding rolling stock. We have folks that come from all over, and some of the gypsies have recently rebuilt one of the major steel bridges and a turntable.

Because I am somewhat limited in the time I have to be on-site, I have managed to talk the management into allowing me to rebuild and repair rolling stock. So, every spring and fall I bring a project home, and take it back next trip, mechanically sound and repainted and ready for another 20 or so years in service.

This spring I brought one of Roy's Pullmans home. It is an all wood construction, old style Pullman with the rounded windows, which the craftsman that built it cut and milled out all of the window and door frames and trim. The sides are plywood as is the floor, and the sides were cut or routed to simulate siding. Time and the elements have taken their toll, and the plywood has begin to delaminate, with the scribed layer peeling off. In addition, the floor is water-damaged on the ends, and there are some other structural issues. Clearly more than meets the eye when one is just dusting it off and rolling it into the trailer. There were a few raised eyebrows when I volunteered to load it up, and I guess now I know why.

Still, this is the next project. A meet is coming up soon, and unfortunately, because of the very ugly summer we have had with temperatures over 100 degrees since early June, I have not had much chance to do much more than a careful inspection, and begin planning what I need to do. Once I get going I'll try and do some documenting as I have for the reefer.

The reefer was mostly mechanically done by early this year, so all of the detail and painting I have managed to accomplish in the last couple of weeks or so. I had started in mid-August, but I was out in the heat on a Saturday, and began stencilling reporting marks and numbers on one end to get the feel of things, and the extreme heat was affecting the paint to when I pulled off the stencil the paint came off with it. So I stopped everything and waited for cooler weather.

The stand is a hydraulic table with casters from Harbor Freight, which I modified for railroad use by bolting I-beams to it, and moving the hydraulic actuator assembly. I use if for loading and unloading equipment, but in the interim, as you note, it is a very handy work table.

Robert, the paint scheme I used is a middle of the era style, after the original billboard types and the next generation, of just reporting marks and data, and LOTS of it. They managed to pare down the amount of lettering and numbers on the car to this style I used, and the next iteration was of course the Maps and Slogans style. By the way, there was at one time some discussion as to whether wood reefers were ever done in maps, but that has since been put to rest.

I prefer the paint mask or stencils for wood equipment, as done right, seems to just fit better with the style and era. It can be repaired and relettered somewhat easily as well. The decal would probably be better for steel cars, although if someone was going to do a string of wood reefers I would rethink the matter. It is a pain.

Brian

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ccvstmr
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by ccvstmr » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:15 pm

Brian, Kevin & Tim,

Quick question...can the masks be re-used? ...are you able to peel those off and put back on a backing paper? I realize you might not want to reuse some of the fancy graphics on a duplicate car...but the data panels have numbering (car dimensions, etc) that might be usable for another car project.

I would agree...adhesive backed vinyl on wood car is NOT the "ideal" combination...but I'm sure over time this too will start to fade. Once again...it's hard to tell the difference from 10 feet away. Still...always looking for alternative ways to reach the same endpoint. Thanx. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!

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Kevin_S
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by Kevin_S » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:36 pm

Carl, unfortunatly paint mask can only be used once. They tend to stretch and distort during the removal process, plus it would be hard to place middle sections of the mask on the backing just right, just think about the letter "O". How would you place the center back in there exactly perfect.
-Kevin S.

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FLtenwheeler
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by FLtenwheeler » Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:50 am

Carl

That is one reason that I purchased my own plotter. On more than one occasion I have spoiled a stencil. I just cut a new stencil with weeding it takes about 10 minutes.

Fading of the paint is OK in my eyes. That is what happens to the prototype. The vinyl coming of looks bad.

I also do my own artwork as well as making true type fonts from original railroad drawings for my projects.

Tim
He who dies with the most unfinished projects: Should of put more time into their hobby.

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ccvstmr
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by ccvstmr » Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:59 am

Kevin/Tim....thanks for the added insight into the world of masking. Would you guys mind starting a new post and describing your equipment (a few photos never hurt either) and other needs for doing your own masks or vinyl work? I looked into this once several years ago, I realized the investment wasn't justified unless I was going to do dozens of cars. Thanx. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!

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makinsmoke
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Re: Santa Fe reefer

Post by makinsmoke » Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:37 pm

I have removed most of the masks I used on the reefer and stuck them back on the backing.
We'll see.

The fact that the paint weathers as well as the rest of the car and finish is the main reason I paint on the lettering. As noted, the real ones fade and weather, and it would seem strange that the lettering stayed pristine while the rest of the car wore down.

Plus, as I noted earlier, being careful, one can touch up the painted lettering, even years for now.

The baked, peeling vinyl, is probably a removal, then complete sand and repaint of the body, then re-application of the lettering. At that point nothing will remain of the original, and you are essentially starting from scratch.

I'll just run the car into the shop, service the trucks and couplers, do any repairs necessary to the body, clean and lightly sand, reletter the car using the original painted lettering, then repaint. By hand.

Brian

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