Good Screwdrivers With Handles That Don't Dissolve?

[SteveHGraham]

I truly look forward to receiving the new screwdrivers. For all my love of Asian tools, there is nothing like going first class.

[Rich_Carlstedt]

Surprised no one has mentioned Grace Wooden handled screwdrivers !
Not only the most comfortable you can imagine, but the square shanks allow a wrench to be applied for those high torque moments and made with good steel here in the US of A .
Rich


http://shop.brownells.com/gunsmith-tool ... 54-008-000

[pete]

I have a set of those Grace screwdrivers Rich and they're as good as you say they are. I don't use them for everyday use though. They're kept for gun work where the tips match the screws properly. The standard tapered tip on most screwdrivers couldn't be designed more poorly. They put all the torque at the weakest point of the screw head. About all there really good for is opening and stirring cans of paint. Brownells straight ground sets or the ones that take the replaceable tips are likely the best you'll find in North America for slotted screw heads. Standard tapered tip screwdrivers have resulted in more buggered up screw heads on high value guns and are a sure sign of amateur work. I've done a few myself before I learned to use the correct fitting screw drivers. Brownells also sell a grinding stone meant for custom fitting their screwdriver tips to just about anything that comes along with just a drill press to grind the tips.

[SteveHGraham]

Wait. Hold it. I did all this research and still bought the wrong thing?

[Rich_Carlstedt]

Sorry to get in late. I have those German screwdrivers and they are good.
But when I use my wooden handles, I have a smile..every time
Rich

[SteveHGraham]

I am not a gunsmith, so I didn't know gun screws posed special problems. I would have no problem with spending a few bucks on the right screwdrivers, if I were sure it mattered. This is something I never heard about before. I can't remember the last time I used a screwdriver on a gun, but it could certainly come up.

The Wera Chiseldrivers arrived. They look fantastic, apart from being extremely ugly. Every one has a full-length shank, a steel cap for hammering, a shank you can put a wrench on, and a hex bolster by the handle. Hopefully they will serve me better than my Kleins in wet situations.

I'm not totally sure what the Kleins are good for, now that I know they don't stop electricity. I guess they're great if you never, ever use them around liquids or electricity.

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

I am not a gunsmith, so I didn't know gun screws posed special problems.

I bought a set of the Brownell's replaceable tip screw drivers a long time ago.
Gun people don't like to "bugger" the slots on their screws. A proper fitting
screw driver is essential to preventing damage to the slot. If the tip is really
properly fitted to the screw slot, the screw driver should be able to stand up
by itself when placed in the screw (when the screw driver and screw are in
a vertical orientation).

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

[SteveHGraham]

So it's not enough to get good screwdrivers? You need gunsmith's screwdrivers?

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

So it's not enough to get good screwdrivers? You need gunsmith's screwdrivers?

The screws used on firearms are generally fillister head screws. As defined:

The Fillister Head has a rounded top surface, cylindrical sides, and a flat bearing surface.
The greater side height is what distinguishes it from a Pan Head. It is the preferred head
style for use in counterbored holes.

Also, "gun screws" have narrower slots than general screws (in comparison to
their diameter). Most hardware type screwdrivers are too thick at the tip in
comparison at the same diameter and generally cannot fit the slot (unless re-
ground to fit). Also, the tip of the general hardware screw driver tapers in
thickness at the tip where the Gunsmith screw driver has parallel sides at the
tip. The tapered tip make the screw driver easier to insert into the slot but
its bearing is then more on the upper portion of the slot instead of the whole
depth of the slot. This is why the hardware store screw driver is more likely
to mar the slot of the screw. One should bear in mind that the screws used
in firearms are often tightened more (due to the need to hold fast during
repeated firings of the gun). This makes gun screws more likely to be marred
by ill-fitting screw drivers.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

[pete]

Gun screws don't pose any special problems, it's the people who use the wrong screwdrivers that do. Well made slotted screws work just fine. I'm not talking about slotted screws you'd buy off the shelf at a hardware store that are formed in a die at thousands per minute, but precision made machine and wood screws like fine guns, tools and equipment have. I'd say even the off the shelf screws can be tightened far more securely and loosened much easier with those flat ground screwdriver tips. On something with smaller screws where it's frozen in place for whatever reason you'll usually shear the head off before the screwdriver slips or leaves a mark on the head. The first time you use a good screwdriver tip that does fit the depth, width and over it's full slot length is an eye opener. A good fitting screw driver tip is almost but not quite a snap fit in the slot. Most people today have never used that type and think the tapered tips are all that's needed. If those did just happen to fit the slot width tight enough there usually then not touching the bottom of the slot, and even if they do all the torque is still applied at the very top and weakest area of the screw slot because of that stupid taper. A tapered tip that can't completely fit the slot width, depth and length raises a burr as the drivers usually sharp corner applies the torque against the top edge of the slot. If they do fit the width and length that does help, but the depth is important for anything really tight. Most of the hammer type impact driver sets I've seen use flat ground tips for doing slotted screws so you have a better chance at removing a real tight screw.

Well fitting flat ground tips won't leave marks. On real tight screws todays common tapered tip just helps the tip cam out of the slot with even more possible damage to anything around the screw head. Watch, clock, telescope, optics, intrument makers, or anyone doing work like that are much the same and would likely all use the flat ground tips. Almost all the old lathes I've seen videos of that used those well made slotted machine screws such as South Bends, P&W etc usually show marks where the wrong and too small screwdriver has been used. No damage almost always means it's never been apart, or at least the previous owners did know what to use.The same can be seen on a lot of used measuring equipment. With the variety of slot widths, depths and lengths it takes a very large number of tips to cover almost anything. That's why Brownells offer those tip grinding kits so that a larger tip can be custom ground to fit when something oddball does show up. If all a person is doing is automotive flat rate work then the tapered tips are about good enough to get most jobs done I guess. There still a really poorly thought out design given the actual requirements and physics of screw instalation and removal imo.

Buggered up screw heads on a high end Rolex that's been repaired is going to affect it's value by a lot even for people who know nothing about who or what actualy did it. And seeing that would raise some real questions for me about that repair and the talents of who did it.The same thing happens with expensive and rare guns or probably anything else of value. But as others have mentioned gun owners are especially picky about seeing those butched screw heads. I'm still ashamed of the few of them I've done even when I just didn't know any better.

[SteveHGraham]

This hobby never stops getting weirder. Thanks for all the information. I suppose $30 is a reasonable price to pay to do it right.

[pete]

Nope, it's mostly logic. Once you learn what something needs to be done correctly then at least that subject gets a bit easier. Computers, electrial, trig and women now those topics are weird and at least one of those is impossible.