Sheet metal for building a tender and ballast car?

[Glenn Brooks]

Hello all,

I am planning on starting construction of a 1/4 scale tender for my 12" ga 4-4-0. Also need to build a ballast car (maybe about 8' x 24" wide x 32" tall.)

Can anyone advise what thickness and type of material would be optimal for the body of these type cars - given 1/4 scale and riveted construction?

(I am a novice regarding sheet metal work )

Thanks much!

Glenn

[CaptonZap]

18 or 16 ga should do it, if you have the ribs along the length. Mild steel, of course. Most sheet metal shop can shear and break the iron.

CZ

[Gary Armitstead]

I know you are working in a much larger scale than my 1/8th scale Baldwin electric........but I used 16ga. steel sheet metal. To beef up the walls, I had the sheet metal shop make some 1/2 X 1/2 inch angle stock 16ga. Made it very solid.

[Mr Ron]

Are you going riveted construction for the "authentic look"? If not, why not welded? A riveted tender will have to have water tight seams; much easier to accomplish with welding. Don't forget swash bulkheads in the tender for stability. I would recommend the car builders encyclopedia for construction details. It can be downloaded from the internet from Google books.

[Glenn Brooks]

Thanks all, for your comments and replies. Looks like 16 ga might do the trick.

Gary! Nice looking build. Any chance you could post some photos of your structure detail? Iam particularily interested in what the inside of a row or rivets and reinforcing frame looks like, after they are set in place.

And Mr. Ron: yes, would like to try the riveted approach with traditional methods. I think I will skip all the leaky tender drama by using a poly insert water tank. These are almost universal in the marine industry these days for potable water, and holding tanks. Worst case I can have one custom made for not much more thanmoff the shelf. Maybe install two, half size each in lieu of internal bulkheads. Of course there's always a learning curve with new things, and initial concepts don't always work out!

Thanks all, very helpful suggestions.
Glenn

[Gary Armitstead]

Glenn,

I found one photo I could post. Hope this helps. I can get better pictures today and post them tonight.

You can see both of the upper cab side wall right angle supports. There are identical angle pieces at the bottom of the cab wall.....they just don't show in this photo. At this point, I used clecos to hold the cab end wall to the riveted short vertical angle to check the alignment of the pre-drilled rivet holes in the end walls (3/32" diameter copper rivets) used throughout the assembly.

[Glenn Brooks]

Gary, thanks. I can't quite tell if you have vertical reinforcements on the side panels between the windows, or if this is all one sheet. can you advise? Do you anticipate putting trim around the windows? if so how would that be put on?

Glenn

[Gary Armitstead]

Gary, thanks. I can't quite tell if you have vertical reinforcements on the side panels between the windows, or if this is all one sheet. can you advise? Do you anticipate putting trim around the windows? if so how would that be put on?

Glenn

Glenn,

The ONLY vertical reinforcements are on each end of the cab sides. In my scale (1/8th), these walls are only about 9 inches tall, so they are very stable with the vertical reinforcement on each end. All one sheet, approximately 9 X 30 inches. As to the window trim, our windows were made by a cabinet maker using mahogany and real glass (.090 thick). The sliding windows for the engineer are functional.

[Glenn Brooks]

Gary, Impressive!

Thanks
Glenn

[Mr Ron]

Glenn,
I found one photo I could post. Hope this helps. I can get better pictures today and post them tonight.

You can see both of the upper cab side wall right angle supports. There are identical angle pieces at the bottom of the cab wall.....they just don't show in this photo. At this point, I used clecos to hold the cab end wall to the riveted short vertical angle to check the alignment of the pre-drilled rivet holes in the end walls (3/32" diameter copper rivets) used throughout the assembly.

Except for the riveted end corner pieces, I assume the rivet detail is embossed. How do you do the embossing?

[Gary Armitstead]

Glenn,
I found one photo I could post. Hope this helps. I can get better pictures today and post them tonight.

You can see both of the upper cab side wall right angle supports. There are identical angle pieces at the bottom of the cab wall.....they just don't show in this photo. At this point, I used clecos to hold the cab end wall to the riveted short vertical angle to check the alignment of the pre-drilled rivet holes in the end walls (3/32" diameter copper rivets) used throughout the assembly.

Except for the riveted end corner pieces, I assume the rivet detail is embossed. How do you do the embossing?

ALL of the rivets in this cab are 3/32 diameter body. with a .170 diameter copper domed head. Real rivets, not embossed.