Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

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Conrad_R_Hoffman
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Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by Conrad_R_Hoffman » Wed May 15, 2019 8:05 pm

Hot off the press, and in need of comments. Note that there are links to three sound files and one spreadsheet. Tell me what you think... am I off my rocker?

http://www.conradhoffman.com/grindbalance.htm

I noticed two typos, but will wait for comments before correcting them.

Thanks!
Conrad

1947 Logan 211 Lathe, Grizzly G1006 mill/drill, Clausing DP,
Boyar-Schultz 612H surface grinder, Sunnen hone, import
bandsaw, lots of measurement stuff, cutters, clutter & stuff.


"May the root sum of the squares of the Forces be with you."

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GlennW
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by GlennW » Wed May 15, 2019 8:38 pm

Balancing washers.

Sopko part number 00798. Bottom of page.

http://www.wmsopko.com/sopko_092.htm
Glenn

Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!

Conrad_R_Hoffman
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by Conrad_R_Hoffman » Wed May 15, 2019 9:58 pm

Saw those, no idea how much they cost. My guess is they could be a bit tricky to adapt the 4-pass technique to, but with some index marks it might not be too difficult.
Conrad

1947 Logan 211 Lathe, Grizzly G1006 mill/drill, Clausing DP,
Boyar-Schultz 612H surface grinder, Sunnen hone, import
bandsaw, lots of measurement stuff, cutters, clutter & stuff.


"May the root sum of the squares of the Forces be with you."

spro
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by spro » Thu May 16, 2019 12:02 am

This is a surprisingly good link. Thanks Conrad! I didn't notice the typos or self corrected them.

Harold_V
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by Harold_V » Thu May 16, 2019 3:08 am

Nice!
I envy you your electronics ability. That device is likely beyond my ability.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

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GlennW
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by GlennW » Thu May 16, 2019 6:37 am

Conrad_R_Hoffman wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 9:58 pm
Saw those, no idea how much they cost. My guess is they could be a bit tricky to adapt the 4-pass technique to, but with some index marks it might not be too difficult.
I honestly can't remember as I use them on 8" wheels. The larger 14" wheels I use have wheel adapters with the sliding weights built in.

I balance using a balancing arbor on a Stuhr for wheels that matter. It works quite well.

Using them for dynamic balancing might be a bit tricky.
Glenn

Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!

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BadDog
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by BadDog » Thu May 16, 2019 10:40 am

You got my attention. I'm not at all experienced with surface grinding. I have a somewhat larger/heavier 6x12 that takes an 8" wheel with the slightly larger ("industrial" I'm told?) taper that makes finding hubs harder and more expensive. But most of my wheel collection is 7", and I've been using an 8" gel cell wheel (don't recall the details) for almost everything I do. Finish generally isn't my goal, but has been very good. My main goal is to provide an excellent flat surface for sealing. For example, the custom turbo oil return flange/tube I did recently, or the wet wheel hubs I'll likely be doing this weekend. So not too interested in a big or expensive project for my needs. Still, who knows what the future brings.

I'm intrigued by the possibility of using a phone, but have my doubts about the resolution being sufficient. So I looked on Amazon (not much effort) and found these that look like they are affordable and easily utilized. But I don't know enough to read the specs to be sure. And of course as with any cheap import electronics, YMMV anyway. What are your thoughts on these, assuming they work as advertised?

Cheaper unit with TERRIBLE reviews

More expensive, not many reviews and mixed.

There are other variations by the same company, all with mixed, bad, or no reviews. The small project board options look to be by far the best option from that source, but not looking for a project that size. And Amazon not the best resource for such things, but was low effort for a quick look.
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SteveHGraham
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by SteveHGraham » Thu May 16, 2019 11:21 am

Cries out for Youtube.
Every hard-fried egg began life sunny-side up.

Conrad_R_Hoffman
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by Conrad_R_Hoffman » Thu May 16, 2019 1:09 pm

The data output speed on those Witmotion units is low. I wouldn't trust them for vibration work.

Now I have to look up gel cell wheels! edit- never mind, that's my SG wheel. Dressing is important for those and I probably don't have the best diamond for it.

I detest most Youtube videos as they take more time than I've got- information density too low. Some people are finally smart, and speed up the sections where they don't need to be real time. I also like to scroll up and down as needed, certainly doable with videos, but awkward. OK, the truth, I don't own anything that takes decent videos!

I used a Harig 612 for many years at a place I worked and had little trouble with out-of-balance wheels. It wasn't something anybody thought about. I suspect that some vibration gets overcome in dressing, as the wheel ends up a bit elliptical to compensate. We seemed to have to dress constantly to maintain the surface finish. Once I balance, I can go a long time without a redress, unless the wheel picks up something.
Conrad

1947 Logan 211 Lathe, Grizzly G1006 mill/drill, Clausing DP,
Boyar-Schultz 612H surface grinder, Sunnen hone, import
bandsaw, lots of measurement stuff, cutters, clutter & stuff.


"May the root sum of the squares of the Forces be with you."

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BadDog
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by BadDog » Thu May 16, 2019 2:14 pm

The one I was given (brand new) with the machine is a Macklin. He called it "gel cell", so that's what I call it, but it appears that maybe that's actually "seeded gel"? It has fairly large blue dots in the AO wheel, where seeded gel is much finer dots. Oddly, I can't find it with Google, and the blotter is covered by the hub. The closest I can find is Norton.

https://www.nortonabrasives.com/en-us/s ... rch=seeded gel

No idea on the details, but once I mounted that and tried it, it's not been back off the machine. Holds a dress really well, removes stock nicely, but provides a finish that is excellent for my needs. Sorry I can't get more information without unmounting the wheel, which is freshly dressed and ready to go for this pending hub face project. He had some more of these when I got the machine and starter set of wheels, so I hope to get at least one more.
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BadDog
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by BadDog » Thu May 16, 2019 2:19 pm

I decided the most useful thing might be a picture. Maybe someone will know more about it, and I can learn something.
IMG_20190516_121528.jpg
Russ
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Harold_V
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Re: Balancing grinding wheels- my new page

Post by Harold_V » Thu May 16, 2019 3:29 pm

Having left precision grinding in the mid '60's, and the shop in general in '83, I have no clue. There were no such wheels when I was actively participating, and I was away from the industry when they were introduced. However, it seems quite odd. Can't help but wonder if, maybe, the dots are nothing more than for appearance, perhaps to help identify a different method of bonding the wheel. That used to be accomplished in the markings of the wheel provided by the maker. An example might be something like 38A60J6VB the V denoting that the wheel is vitrified.

I'd certainly be interested in learning more about "modern" wheels.

Have they *really* re-invented the wheel? :)
H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

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