Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
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Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
Thought I would post a short user report on my experiences with Benjamin Moore “Super Spec” (now called Ultra Spec) Alkyd Metal Primer. In short: It’s very good stuff!
Of all the paint brands available here in the Seattle area, Ultra Spec is the only heavy solvent based primer I could find.
ALL the other brands of metal primer are some version of “universal” or Acrylic (Code names for water based) formulation. This time around I couldn’t find my old stand by - Super Spec Aklyd, so purchased a gallon of the “new” universal (water based) metal primer and tested on two pieces of prepared, shinny bright 3/8” mild steel motor mount spacers. This test with the water based “metal” primer caused flash rusting that stained right though the coating as it dried. Conclusion: Horrible stuff.
After some detailed investigation, I found Sherwin Williams and Benjamin Moore have almost identical water based primer chemical composition, in their so called “universal” metal primers, according to their SDS data sheets. So I returned this lously excuse for a primer, and went searching for my old stand by - Super Spec alkyd primer. I guess Benjamin moore and Sherwin Williams must both know these are universally bad metal primers, as they use the “universal” name in both product lines.
Then, After three days of pestering my local Moore dealer, they finally scratched up a gallon of their Ultra Spec alkyd (petroleum based) primer. It is considered a heavy solvent primer, as it accepts top coats formulated with heavy solvents, such as urethane based paints. It is indeed An Ultra primer. I applied it the motor mounts and base plate assemblies I’ve been working on and am again, very pleased with the results. Paint spreads readily at a proper thickness with a brush, levels well, and dries tough as nails. I’ve found it dries to an extremely tough finish, does not chip, and accepts both urethane, aklyd, and acrylic (water based) topcoats.
Here are a couple of parts, with fresh primer just applied. They look shiny, but dry to a flat finish.
This is my fourth gallon in five years. I’ve used it to prep locomotive and car frames, and outdoor weldments, such as steel bridge frames and decks. Normally I apply a coat of rust remover, two coats of primer, and finish with two urethane top coats. So the overall finish is very rust resistant, and long lasting. I think The key to paint longevity, is this primer. My oldest bridge structures on my backyard railway are rife years old. They shows no sign of rusting, staining, weathering, blistering,or flaking. I once tested the primer on a steel flat car, by beating on it with a ballpeen hammer. The paint did not flake or chip with this level of abuse. Pretty amazing. AhHaha. Don’t paint it on anything you may want to strip off and re do latter.
The primer comes in white, grey and red oxide colors. I only used red oxide as I love that tone as an undercoat.
Anyway, from time to time people on the forum discuss what paints they like best for machine tools or loco builds. My go to primer from here on in, will always be this stuff.
Glenn
Of all the paint brands available here in the Seattle area, Ultra Spec is the only heavy solvent based primer I could find.
ALL the other brands of metal primer are some version of “universal” or Acrylic (Code names for water based) formulation. This time around I couldn’t find my old stand by - Super Spec Aklyd, so purchased a gallon of the “new” universal (water based) metal primer and tested on two pieces of prepared, shinny bright 3/8” mild steel motor mount spacers. This test with the water based “metal” primer caused flash rusting that stained right though the coating as it dried. Conclusion: Horrible stuff.
After some detailed investigation, I found Sherwin Williams and Benjamin Moore have almost identical water based primer chemical composition, in their so called “universal” metal primers, according to their SDS data sheets. So I returned this lously excuse for a primer, and went searching for my old stand by - Super Spec alkyd primer. I guess Benjamin moore and Sherwin Williams must both know these are universally bad metal primers, as they use the “universal” name in both product lines.
Then, After three days of pestering my local Moore dealer, they finally scratched up a gallon of their Ultra Spec alkyd (petroleum based) primer. It is considered a heavy solvent primer, as it accepts top coats formulated with heavy solvents, such as urethane based paints. It is indeed An Ultra primer. I applied it the motor mounts and base plate assemblies I’ve been working on and am again, very pleased with the results. Paint spreads readily at a proper thickness with a brush, levels well, and dries tough as nails. I’ve found it dries to an extremely tough finish, does not chip, and accepts both urethane, aklyd, and acrylic (water based) topcoats.
Here are a couple of parts, with fresh primer just applied. They look shiny, but dry to a flat finish.
This is my fourth gallon in five years. I’ve used it to prep locomotive and car frames, and outdoor weldments, such as steel bridge frames and decks. Normally I apply a coat of rust remover, two coats of primer, and finish with two urethane top coats. So the overall finish is very rust resistant, and long lasting. I think The key to paint longevity, is this primer. My oldest bridge structures on my backyard railway are rife years old. They shows no sign of rusting, staining, weathering, blistering,or flaking. I once tested the primer on a steel flat car, by beating on it with a ballpeen hammer. The paint did not flake or chip with this level of abuse. Pretty amazing. AhHaha. Don’t paint it on anything you may want to strip off and re do latter.
The primer comes in white, grey and red oxide colors. I only used red oxide as I love that tone as an undercoat.
Anyway, from time to time people on the forum discuss what paints they like best for machine tools or loco builds. My go to primer from here on in, will always be this stuff.
Glenn
Moderator - Grand Scale Forum
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
I'll second that, Glen. I get mine from the Ben. Moore here. They supply to the paper mill.
Brushes on and smooth as a ......
Pete
Brushes on and smooth as a ......
Pete
Just tryin'
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
I've experienced the same lousy performance from water based primers. Not worth a damn, in my opinion, and will not be purchased for metal again.
A recentl project, including some blasted steel, demanded a spray primer, oil based. I was giving some thought to using Kilz, but the heavy viscosity would have made it a bad choice for the guns I have (old technology high pressure guns). Secure in the knowledge that some oil based paints use Acetone as a thinner when spraying, I tried thinning the Kilz with some, using it excessively, then brush applied some to a test piece. It flowed out beautifully, and dried hard as it normally does with no ill-effects. That encouraged me to use it for the project, thinning adequately, but sparingly. I'm happy to report that it worked perfectly. A good dodge when in need of a metal primer. My use is indoors, not outdoors.
H
A recentl project, including some blasted steel, demanded a spray primer, oil based. I was giving some thought to using Kilz, but the heavy viscosity would have made it a bad choice for the guns I have (old technology high pressure guns). Secure in the knowledge that some oil based paints use Acetone as a thinner when spraying, I tried thinning the Kilz with some, using it excessively, then brush applied some to a test piece. It flowed out beautifully, and dried hard as it normally does with no ill-effects. That encouraged me to use it for the project, thinning adequately, but sparingly. I'm happy to report that it worked perfectly. A good dodge when in need of a metal primer. My use is indoors, not outdoors.
H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
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Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
Harold, I thought about Kilz. They make some kind of solvent based primer in addition to their latex stuff. I’ve used it for interior oil trim in the old days, with good results. Never tried it on metal, so good to hear it can work.
It’s becoming more and more difficult to find the Ultra Spec oil primer. Iam afraid eventually it to will be banned from use.
Fortunately, some of the urethane metal topcoats are now self etching, and don’t require a primer. Maybe that’s the way of future...
Glenn
It’s becoming more and more difficult to find the Ultra Spec oil primer. Iam afraid eventually it to will be banned from use.
Fortunately, some of the urethane metal topcoats are now self etching, and don’t require a primer. Maybe that’s the way of future...
Glenn
Moderator - Grand Scale Forum
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
On the subject of types of paint, lacquer has become very difficult to obtain.
H
H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
- liveaboard
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Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
I was sold some water based floor varnish about 20 years ago; what disaster stuff. It hardly penetrated the wood at all and made my hardwood floor look horrible.
When I finally went to sand it off, it was too soft and would clog up the paper immediately.
I had to use stripper, and then scrape the entire 100 m2 on my hands and knees.
Oil based polyurethane is what stubborn old guys put on their wood!
And that's what's on that floor now.
For most metal painting, I use primerless paint like hammerite, very hard and because it only needs 2 coats, it's fast.
I've been using a cheap brand that our discount supermarket sells only on occasion; $6 a litter. Looks ok, wears well. Not the greatest but at that price it will do for most things.
When I painted my car a few years ago, the color coat was only available in a water base, while the primer was a heavy solvent and the top coat was a 2 component solvent.
Strange.
I'm painting my house today, with water based paint. Easy to use, no stink, great stuff. For house walls.
When I finally went to sand it off, it was too soft and would clog up the paper immediately.
I had to use stripper, and then scrape the entire 100 m2 on my hands and knees.
Oil based polyurethane is what stubborn old guys put on their wood!
And that's what's on that floor now.
For most metal painting, I use primerless paint like hammerite, very hard and because it only needs 2 coats, it's fast.
I've been using a cheap brand that our discount supermarket sells only on occasion; $6 a litter. Looks ok, wears well. Not the greatest but at that price it will do for most things.
When I painted my car a few years ago, the color coat was only available in a water base, while the primer was a heavy solvent and the top coat was a 2 component solvent.
Strange.
I'm painting my house today, with water based paint. Easy to use, no stink, great stuff. For house walls.
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Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
Eventually petroleum solvents will be entirely banned from retail products.
- gwerhart0800
- Posts: 225
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- Location: Loveland, CO USA
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
Bummer, no US distributors for Hammerite.liveaboard wrote: ↑Thu Mar 25, 2021 3:45 am For most metal painting, I use primerless paint like hammerite, very hard and because it only needs 2 coats, it's fast.
George Erhart
Loveland, CO
https://lovelandcreatorspace.com
Loveland, CO
https://lovelandcreatorspace.com
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
No US distributors for Hammerite? I must be misunderstanding, you can find it lots of places. I've used it quite a bit in the past. Seems like I got spray and quarts from HD, Ace, and maybe even Amazon, among others.
Russ
Master Floor Sweeper
Master Floor Sweeper
- liveaboard
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Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
For larger metal objects that need paint, I use cheaper stuff now; my experience is that it lasts almost as long.
At first I'd sand it all down first; now I just clean the old paint with a lot of high pressure water, then roll primer and then paint with Jotun marine paint.
At first I'd sand it all down first; now I just clean the old paint with a lot of high pressure water, then roll primer and then paint with Jotun marine paint.
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Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
A year or so ago, hammer right completely disappeared from our local stores here in the Northwest. I also was told it was no longer carried in the US. Maybe it’s a regional thing, or maybe they have new owners with different distributors. I kind of quit using it because their new formulation wasn’t nearly as good as the old. So haven’t really look forward in the last year are two.
Moderator - Grand Scale Forum
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Re: Ultra Spec Metal primer report: Good Stuff!
I haven't gotten any I can recall in recent years, so maybe I'm just behind the times. But Google claims it's available from a few places. And Pac-NW has basically become Hyper Progressive So-Cal North, so I would be surprised if it were removed from the entire west coast.
Russ
Master Floor Sweeper
Master Floor Sweeper