New to me Logan 11" model 1955: just about done, pix page 3

All discussion about lathes including but not limited to: South Bend, Hardinge, Logan, Monarch, Clausing and other HSM lathes, including imports

Moderators: Harold_V, GlennW

EvilTwin
Posts: 30
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:13 am

New to me Logan 11" model 1955: just about done, pix page 3

Post by EvilTwin » Tue Jan 25, 2011 1:11 pm

A while back I posted about a possible 9" southbend, but that one never came to pass. Before Christmas I got wind of a 11" Logan that was available about 7 states away. Based on the description and the reputation of the guy that was selling it on another forum, I bought it sight unseen. I was then able to arrange a "rucker" or a ride for the machine from NH all the way down to VA. The lathe got here this last weekend after lots of anticipation.

Somebody else posted about this same model, and for sure that one is prettier. This machine suffers from "Klown Paint" but I will remedy that in due course. The PO made some repairs to it along the way, but never put any more paint to it then how he got it about 15 years earlier.

As far as I can tell, it is in very good shape mechanically. Ways look good, gears are all present and intact. Last night was the first time I was able to power it up, it was wired for 220 and I didn't have a spare plug to use with it. It ran smooth enough, I was able to move the carriage back and forth and tried several different gear combinations for the leadscrew. I don't have any cutters with it so I have an order in to Enco for a set of carbide tooling. I figured it's a good start and wasnt that expensive compared to the rest of what I have in it right now. I also ordered a set of vibration pad feet that will also act as levelors. Right now its bolted to some 2x6's for transport. I want to be able to do some test turnings and then in a month or so begin to break it down for a refurb. From the serial number it looks to be made sometime between 1966 and 67, not quite as old as me, but not a spring chicken either. So here are some pix of my new toy:

Image

Image

Image

Drive Train:
Image

6" 4 Jaw and 8" 3 Jaw Skinner Chucks:
Image

Phase 1 toolpost:
Image

Sellers Photo:
Image

I'll be asking for some help along the way, this is my first foray into metal lathes. Thanks for looking.

Bob Aquino
Last edited by EvilTwin on Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

John Evans
Posts: 2153
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 9:33 pm
Location: Phoenix ,AZ

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by John Evans » Tue Jan 25, 2011 3:51 pm

looks pretty good to me. Headstock spindal looks to have a usuable size through hole also. To repeat Harold don't rely on carbide , get you some good quailty HS blanks also. Use 5/16 or 3/8s blanks and you will save $ and grind time. Don't get me wrong I do use carbide but also use HS a lot.
www.chaski.com

Rosco-P
Posts: 226
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2010 4:10 pm

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by Rosco-P » Tue Jan 25, 2011 5:20 pm

Much better, stiffer, more modern, more capable than a SB 9". I'd join one of the Logan groups on Yahoo for first hand advice. Logan Actuator still supports their machines, although newly manufactured parts, when available won't be cheap.

User avatar
BadDog
Posts: 4951
Joined: Wed May 17, 2006 8:21 pm
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by BadDog » Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:17 pm

Congrats on the new tool!

But just for reference, that 3 jaw is really too large for that lathe, so you might want to keep an eye open for one more appropriately sized.

And yes, you should probably spend some time reading and implementing the HSS information available in the sticky posts in this forum.
Russ
Master Floor Sweeper

EvilTwin
Posts: 30
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:13 am

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by EvilTwin » Wed Jan 26, 2011 6:37 am

I've started going through the FAQ's and its pretty daunting. But I have time on my hands so I will eventually get through them all. Being able to work metal is a skillset I have been wanting to acquire for a while. Gotta be patient... :shock:

kazlx
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Orange, CA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by kazlx » Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:40 am

Looks familiar :)

Click here

EvilTwin
Posts: 30
Joined: Sun Dec 19, 2010 10:13 am

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by EvilTwin » Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:55 am

Yes it does, that was the one I was referring to. If mine looked like that, I'd probably leave it alone, but will all the brushed on Klown paint, it would bug me no end every time I powered it up. I have several tools still with the orignal finish (Delta wood lathe, Clausing drill press) that were never repainted, but a bunch that I reworked top to bottom (Bandsaw, table saw, RAS, Jointer/Planer to name a few).

Have you done much with it yet?

kazlx
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:47 pm
Location: Orange, CA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by kazlx » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:15 am

I got it leveled a little while ago and have just been playing around just working on doing different things trying to get my technique right. I refinished a dresser a little while ago and want to turn some new legs for it out of aluminum instead of the stock wood ones, but I want to make sure they look good before I do it. So mainly just practicing. I weld and do other stuff in the garage, but this is the first time I have ever operated a piece of machinery like this. It's definitely addicting though. I did make a little aluminum chain ring spacer for my girlfriend's beach cruiser that I built for her.

PixMan
Posts: 528
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:30 am
Location: Spencer MA USA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by PixMan » Sat Jan 29, 2011 11:39 pm

Nice buy, it seems, other than the color differential between the seller's photo and yours. ;)

You're sure going to have a lot of good times with it. I find it somewhat odd that your 3-jaw chuck is so much larger than the 4-jaw. My dad's (16 x 40) lathe is the other way around. The 3-jaw is a 10", the 4-jaw is a 12".

I don't mean to sound negative, but I kinda wish people would not just go out and buy a "carbide insert kit" from Enco (or anyone else for that matter) before understanding tooling. Of course Harold is spot-on that for most folks it's a good idea to learn to grind and use HSS tooling before getting into carbide. But I will say that to me it's not always a carved-in-stone must-do thing...IF you get a sound education about selecting and using carbide insert tooling.

What tooling did you get, one of those 5 or 6 tool kits that all take the same TNMG, TPMT, or TCMT inserts? I try to discourage people from buying those kits, but instead get a couple of good quality toolholders. That's about all you'd need. Half of the tools in those kits never see metal.

Best of luck to you with the new lathe. Really!
Last edited by PixMan on Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

Harold_V
Posts: 18297
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by Harold_V » Sun Jan 30, 2011 1:12 am

PixMan wrote:I don't mean to sound negative, but I kinda wish people would just go out and buy a "carbide insert kit" from Enco (or anyone else for that matter) before understanding tooling.
The problem with that theory, and it is proven time and again by questions asked by readers that are obvious to those of us that grind tools, is what constitutes an acceptable carbide insert kit? Your comments, below, betray your suggestion.

It is my opinion, based on inquiries on this forum, often at the admission of the individual concerned, that those that make that decision do so in an attempt to avoid learning the principles of grinding functional tool bits. The net result is that they have no clue what constitutes a proper cutting tool, nor what would be required to achieve their goal. I take an opposing stance----one whereby carbide insert tooling should be considered ONLY when a firm understanding of cutting tool geometry is at hand, so intelligent decisions can be made. Further, depending on the nature of the machine in question, I could just as easily say carbide should NOT be considered at all. It simply is not the panacea that industry has created in the minds of button pushers that have no clue about the intricacies of operating manual machines. For them, it may be true, but hardly true for the small shop with limited resources, limited capacity machines and fractional horsepower spindles. There simply are not enough benefits for an individual to get invested in them when they can be, and generally are, served perfectly well by HSS. The few exceptions that may occur can be addressed perfectly well by the use of brazed carbide. I would offer as examples, a chilled gray iron casting, or machining abrasive materials such as fiber glass boards. Beyond that, it's rare to encounter a material that can't be addressed perfectly well by HSS.
Of course Harold is spot-on that for most folks it's a good idea to learn to grind and use HSS tooling before getting into carbide.
Exactly. For the same reason a person is well advised to learn to play the piano before scheduling their first recital. To do anything less is circumventing that which is required in order for a person to proclaim themselves a machinist.
But I will say that to me it's not always a carved-in-stone must-do thing...IF you get a sound education about selecting and using carbide insert tooling.
My question is---how does one do that? When an individual lacks the fundamentals, it's not easy to understand what is needed, and why. You can spend hundreds of dollars on useless inserts and tool holders based on decisions made when you aren't qualified to make decisions at all.

Again, my advice to anyone starting out is to learn to grind tool bits. Only when that has been mastered will an individual find himself free--------otherwise it's like trying to navigate strange territory without a map. A tremendous amount of frustration can be avoided by doing it right in the first place.
What tooling did you get, one of those 5 or 6 tool kits that all take the same TNMG, TPMT, or TCMT inserts? I try to discourage people from buying those kits, but instead get a couple of good quality toolholders. That's about all you'd need. Half of the tools in those kits never see metal.
Need I say more? A person that lacks the understanding isn't capable of making a sound decision and wouldn't have a clue what constitutes a "good quality toolholder". You're placing the cart before the horse.

Harold
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

PixMan
Posts: 528
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:30 am
Location: Spencer MA USA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by PixMan » Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:03 am

Harold,

A simple slip of omitting a word in my post has once again raised your ire. Apparently. I'm sorry and I corrected that post.

I do NOT suggest anyone buy the carbide insert tooling kits of those Chinese-made junk. Ever. They generally make for so much more expense and frustration than the low cost of the kit can justify.

All I'm saying is that it is ALWAYS going to be be beneficial to learn cutting tool geometry and how it works before investing too much in tooling. The cheapest and easiest way to learn it, is to grind your own HSS tools. And on many older low-speed & low-HP machines, that HSS tooling is all you need for 90% of what you need to do.

There are some people who just have no interest in doing that, wrong though it may be. People like me might be able to help them choose task-specific quality carbide insert tooling that can solve an immediate problem, as long as they go into it eyes-wide-open that it can cost far more than simple HSS solutions.

Harold_V
Posts: 18297
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: New to me Logan 11" model 1955

Post by Harold_V » Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:54 pm

PixMan wrote:I do NOT suggest anyone buy the carbide insert tooling kits of those Chinese-made junk. Ever. They generally make for so much more expense and frustration than the low cost of the kit can justify.
That's apparently nothing new. Many years ago, while I still lived in Utah, a friend (local club member) asked me to evaluate his new insert tooling for his small lathe. The tools were all ½" square shank, and wouldn't cut to his satisfaction.

Small wonder.

They were all intended to be negative rake holders, and had been provided with such inserts, but there was no rake, thus the cutting edge had no relief. To me it was obvious, but I had to explain it in fine detail, for he had little knowledge of how tools cut. That's really my point---never one of discouraging the (informed) use of carbide.

I appreciate your understanding. This forum is unlike most others---here we cater to the guy that's often just starting out and has no clue about most things. I feel it's important for us to reinforce the notion that everyone should learn the basics. If, as you say, they refuse, and choose to go to insert carbide tooling as a dodge, you can trust me in my telling you, they will get little encouragement from me. These are the same people that come to the forum with complaints of not being able to accomplish a given task, because they are calling on tooling that simply isn't suited to their application. Rarely will that be true with HSS, especially if the individual is armed with enough knowledge to grind his/her needs. When that moment arrives, they can also make sound decisions about using, or not using, carbide.

Harold
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

Post Reply