Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

All discussion about lathes including but not limited to: South Bend, Hardinge, Logan, Monarch, Clausing and other HSM lathes, including imports

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Rex
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby Rex » Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:00 pm

Steve, got the motor wiring doc. Reading it now, looks useful. Thanks much for the help!
I'd attach it here but I don't know the copyright issues on it.

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Thu Sep 22, 2011 7:09 pm

I got out and started to look at it today. You know how that goes next thing you are running it. I got the measurements on the spindle, checked to see if by some coincidence the R8-MT4 adapter would fit in the MT5 nose taper (nope), and putzed around at some other stuff. Next thing I know I was getting more familiar with the machine by making a 60mmx8tpi plug/spud just because I had a suitable piece of stock. This thing is no Monarch but it's a solid repeatable machine and I think it will meet my needs as I never intend to run it as a profession.

Threading at 8TPI went well and no issues to blame the lathe. Only problem was I stopped when I hit my mark and screwed the face plate on my spud. It fit perfectly. I remembered that I had a spare back plate and tried it on, perfect. I figured it'd be fine and instead of screwing the 8" four jaw on it I'd just remove it and fit it on the 8" chuck. Which I tried and no good! too tight, the 4 jaw fits the spindle. Hmm Removed the 3 jaw. I am very careful during this evolution and cover the ways (8" is supported) and keep the chuck pushed against the spindle until it un-threads. This time I didn't have the presence of mind to keep it pushed on and let the chuck fall off the spindle. Fortunately my pinky kept it from scarring the ways protector. Hurt like the dickens but all is good and nothing damaged on the machine. I'll build cradles sooner than planned. 2ea 3/4" plywood and the 8" only could fit an index card under it. I'll look at it all again later when i can be a little more analytical.

There was a smaller diameter sticking out the threaded end of stock that I needed to part off. The parting was going very well and then started to get a little "crunchy". I noticed the free end of the parting blade was vibrating so I stopped. The blade was loose. So i tightened it. I said to myself, "self" "huh who said that?" "reset the tool, fool" "nah lets see how it runs" and all was going well until it dug in and made a fish hook. Yep ya'll know angled holder .. Blade slipped in and went low. Hacksaw time. Another lesson I had forgotten. Listen to the voice of reason even if is coming from yourself. I hate to make a fool of me. After sawing the protruding part off I was left with a ring about 2" id and 2 1/2 od x 3/4" thick. I manually faced the plug.

The ring had a end that looked like some idiot sawed it off with a hacksaw. I decided to chuck it up and utilize some more of the power cross feed (a feature I haven't had since about '93). The feed lever simply is moved aft (towards the tail stock) to clear a block and pushed down for cross feed. While the lever is aft you can not move the lever down below the half point to engage the carriage feed. I didn't actually cognitize that the fwd/aft position of the lever was the interlock. All my Navy years as a Machinist Mate we always made sure to put a lever into the detent. So I was skimming the face and moving and moving the lever down then forward to what I (at the time) considered parked. As I was getting more comfortable the process got quicker until I managed to move the lever down and forward while still pressing down and engaged the carriage which moved into the work (towards the chuck). I slapped the power lever down and nothing was harmed. Fortunately I was at low rpm and slow feed so moving the tool into the work wasn't even a heavy cut. So I'll hope to remember when Xfeeding keep the handle aft and only move it forward when ready for longitudinal feeding.

Slow and steady I'm learning the lathe and relearning skills left dormant for years. I'll keep it to low speeds and low feeds until I really know the lathe.

Steve

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Thu Sep 22, 2011 7:23 pm

Rex wrote:Steve, got the motor wiring doc. Reading it now, looks useful. Thanks much for the help!
I'd attach it here but I don't know the copyright issues on it.


I got it from here http://igor.chudov.com/manuals/ElectricMotors.pdf so no foul on us.

Steve

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:57 pm

So having run this lathe as a hobbyist I am delighted with it. I retired from the navy in '95 and spent some time running real machines. I was an MM not an MR., but our rates seriously crossed at that time (at least on AD-44). With the 7x10 I knew it was a toy, but it met my needs for several years. I bought a 9x20 earlier this year and found that it is a perfect lathe for the garage ! Assuming that ALL YOU WANT TO DO IS TURN THE 9X20 INTO SOMETHING USEFUL and your hobby is working on machines ( I have one for sale at a price I couldn't hope for, but if you have more money than sense PM me!). Sorry for the shouting, but it was needed.

I'd had some real problems with some of the members posts about parting. Admittedly some consternation of my own. With a serious budget paid by someone else and a gear head lathe... well even an MM could set it up, read the FPM and feed rate from the tool spec . and flip the feed watch it go (perfectly or south). If it goes south there'll be some 'splanin but the showing of the settings id all I'm. finding with this lathe I don't really have the ability "plug in numbers". So I just cut and see. It explains a good bit about the very different feeds and speeds. With this belt drive lathe I can make it grunt but not cause a failure. Tis a trade?

Wife has arrived and has caught me in the house. ser ya'll later.

Steve

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:36 am

On with the parting. I had a parting tool that came with my axa (import) tool post. Very insubstantial and pixie like. 1/2 inch blade 3/32" thick and the blade was made of some very cheap soft steel. I'll try it again when I get a better cobalt blade. I'd previously only tried parting AL with it. The metal in the attached picture seemed to be about as hard as the blade and attempting to use it resulted in about as much metal coming off the tool as the stock.

Included with the lathe was a bunch of ancient rusty lantern post tooling and a parting tool. So I welded a 1/2 tool blank to it and found it to be an improvement. In the past with real machines I'd run slow and light feed and have good results. That method worked ok with the beltdrive machine but not as well as running a good bit faster figuring if it went south the belts would slip. I have no idea what steel is in the chuck but it is a chore to get a decent finish.

The lathe still had the original belts on it and the 1st reduction belt was a bit bumpy causing the lathe to vibrate. I replaced it with an accu-link which smoothed everything right out. I'll replace the one to the spindle soon but it still seems fairly smooth. Lots of other stuff needing buying and business is slow.

Steve
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partingf.jpg

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:14 pm

So what have I been doing lately? Apparently trying to collect the whole set of collets. On the left is a nice set of 25W collets with a 5MT - 25W adapter in the foreground (next to a hand wheel to make a drawbar if needed). On the near side of the round column is some 5C collets. I recently ordered part# P4026001 from Grizzly which I hope will be the 5MT to 5C collet adapter and allow me to use the drawbar and begin using them. $41.50 is a bargain for that holder bought new.

I tried running a "A" series Accu-Link on the A end it seemed to slip every so often and give me some bad surface finish. A delightful friend of mine owns an excellent machine shop, drive component, bearing, etc supply house
http://www.ndrives.com/
and she gave me the best price I could find on "B" series Accu-Link box of 25'. Great folks there, if you need anything drive products wise call them and ask. So from the 25' box I was able to replace the belts on the lathe, milling/drilling machine.

Steve
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collets 4.JPG

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:12 am

The grizzly collet holder works like a champ. I was slightly disappointed since it is more of a sleeve than a I was expecting and has no flange for the nose protector to push against for removal. Oh well I'd probably end up tapping it out from the back mostly anyhow.

Short one in the picture is the grizzly 5c

Steve
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collets small.JPG

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Sat May 05, 2012 6:43 pm

I got around to making the bushing for the draw bar so now all the Cataract 5 collets work great. click here the drawbar feels as if it was made for the lathe.

I had some issues with runout and DTI'd the sleeve, collets and all looked good then I rotated the 3/4" linear test rod and found the runout was in the rod. Simple things first would make more sense.
I am so hoping that I'll have the time to adapt the w25 collets to the drawbar click here


Steve (having great fun with this hobby)

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GlennW
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby GlennW » Sat May 05, 2012 8:32 pm

Steve,

Does your lathe run smooth?

I have a near identical lathe, different color and name, that I have had for decades and it has had a shake at higher speeds since new. About three weeks ago I pulled that large cast iron pulley off, made a mandrel for it, and balanced it on my grinding wheel balancer. It made a HUGE difference!
Glenn

Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Sun May 06, 2012 5:57 am

Glenn Wegman wrote:Steve,

Does your lathe run smooth?

I have a near identical lathe, different color and name, that I have had for decades and it has had a shake at higher speeds since new. About three weeks ago I pulled that large cast iron pulley off, made a mandrel for it, and balanced it on my grinding wheel balancer. It made a HUGE difference!


Thanks Glenn! I'll have a look at that because it does have a shake when under a load. I was thinking the motor was bouncing since it appears the previous owner removed any tensioning hardware and just left the motor hanging by it's weight. Probably removing the jackshaft gulleys for a balance check will make it easier to get to the motor and figure that one out. Mine appear to be cast AL which probably means I don't have as much of a out of balance but still there.

Steve

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GlennW
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby GlennW » Sun May 06, 2012 9:16 am

Actually, on mine there is no tensioning for the motor belt other than the weight of the motor. That motor has a cast iron case/frame and weighs way more than it looks like it does!
Glenn



Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!

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swatson144
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Re: Hello all, and Jet 1236PS 1236-PS

Postby swatson144 » Sun May 06, 2012 9:59 am

The manual for mine shows a nut bolt and washer rig going into a hole on the motor plate opposite the pivot end and through a hole in the base channel casting. If there actually was one installed that way it would be a royal ache in the backside to change speed ranges. You'd have to have the hands of a reuses monkey to even touch the the nut. You'd also have to have an arm growing out of your chest to hold the bolt head. All without being able to see because your hands were in the way. Probably when the old lads removed it the sound of it clanging around the far end of the shop was most satisfying.

On heavy cuts the motor on mine starts to bounce so until I figure it out I'm keeping it down to lighter cuts. I'm thinking kinda a sine plate arrangement with a roller under the motor plate and a clamp to hold it down onto the roller. It wouldn't take much and would be simple and fast to change speeds.

I will have a look at the pulleys though. That could be a causative factor. If the pulleys are balanced that cast iron motor might never start to bounce.

Steve


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