Is it worth much

[rooster]

Hi im new here and this is my second post , i have a craftsman lathe, commercial either 10 or 12 by 42 i believe , anyway it needs a few things the gear head is noisey and after looking at the gears i find they have a lot of wear on them , what im asking is it worth fixing up? it runs and will cut but ive not tried doing any work with it , the chuck i do not like it works but not to my likeing , just asking opinions here , thanks for looking . Russ (rooster)

[atomarc]

Rooster,

Welcome to the forum. I didn't see where you listed a price for your lathe. For a hobby environment I think it's a very suitable candidate...I'm sure there are folks who would love to have it.


Stuart

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

Hi im new here and this is my second post , i have a craftsman lathe, commercial either 10 or 12 by 42 i believe , anyway it needs a few things the gear head is noisey and after looking at the gears i find they have a lot of wear on them , what im asking is it worth fixing up? it runs and will cut but ive not tried doing any work with it , the chuck i do not like it works but not to my likeing , just asking opinions here , thanks for looking . Russ (rooster)

The question that may be worth asking is: how bad is the rust?
Is this a Katrina victim? If the rust is significant, then the potential
precision is going to be compromised and then it wouldn't be worth
fixing-up. But on bright side, the parts are worth a lot to others
trying to fix theirs.

If the lathe isn't too badly rusted, then it would be worth fixing-up IMHO.
The gears are still available, I believe and not too costly. IIRC, they
are ZAMAC gears (which are precision die cast which keeps the cost
down) and is also the reason they wear out quicker than steel gears.
So, the gears shouldn't scare you.

I'm not sure why you don't like the chuck. The 4-jaw independent chuck
is the most versatile type you can get and can be adjusted to zero run-out
if you take your time to adjust the work in it. The 3-jaw scroll chuck is faster
but rarely as accurate. Most of us have at least one of each.

The down side is they are not a real ridged machine and are limited in capacity
but they are very popular with home shop types and are capable of doing good
work when used by talented people.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

P.S. Welcome to the group!

[Harold_V]

is it worth fixing up?

Tough call, rooster. A great deal depends on what you might hope to accomplish with the machine, and the general condition of the ways and screws. If it has been rusted, you can expect less than stellar performance, but, again, what you expect from the machine will make the decision. Some folks aren't too concerned about the ability to work close---so long as a machine makes chips they're reasonably happy. Others expect (demand, really) far more--the ability to take a serious cut, to hold tenths, and to have the ability to run carbide beneficially. Lots of things to consider in making the decision.

There are features that make a machine tool more or less desirable. One of them is to not have a threaded spindle. While they were commonplace for many years, they were rather restrictive and were replaced by other spindle systems that allowed for running in reverse without risk of losing the chuck. The alternate spindle systems also provided for the ability for a lathe to have a brake on the spindle. As machining technology developed, the ability to use higher spindle speeds evolved, too. That's not to imply your machine isn't capable of decent speeds, for it may be. While speed isn't everything, it is a very desirable feature in that most materials have a "sweet spot" at which they machine best. Low speed spindles generally can not achieve such a speed. Cuts can still be made, of course, but surface finish and production times suffer.

Were I in your shoes, before I made the decision to put much in the machine, I'd consider the benefits. Replacing a series of gears might make it run quieter, but that won't do much for the ability of the machine where wear is concerned. I'd recommend you explore the condition of the ways, screws and nuts, to see if the machine warrants the investment. It may not, and you'd be far better served by buying a new import lathe, or, if you happen to get lucky, a pristine American built machine. Hard to find, and getting ever harder.

Welcome to the forum!

Harold

[rooster]

Thanks for the welcome , as for this lathe , its just surface rust nothing serious and yes it went through katrina but was inside a garage so no harm there, i really dont know anything about how to take it apart to fix but i guess i can try , the ways are not beatup or anything like that everything works as far as i know the feed, cross slide, the gear box etc etc , who knows i might give it a try in the future if i dont sell it .

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

Before taking it apart, get a manual. It will have assembly break-downs
and part numbers in it. Also, look on-line for some Atlas Lathe groups
(like on Yahoo Groups) and join. You will probably find a copy of the manual
that way. In addition, you will find people that will be familiar with your
model and can help with specific questions regarding your model and where
to find parts (like Clausing Industrial).

Don't let Harold scare you out of using a lathe with a threaded spindle nose.
They are very common and unless you are going into professional machine shop
business, quite adequate for the home shop guy. But it all depends on what
you want and expect to get out of the lathe. Don't get me wrong. A threaded
spindle does have limitations but for most lathe work, it isn't that much of an issue.

But Harold's points are ones that a person should address. The Atlas lathe with
its flat ways are not inherently as accurate as lathes with prismatic ways but
there are people that get them to do amazingly accurate work but these people
are ones that have work with their machines and developed skills and techniques
to overcome some of the limitations these lathes have.

I guess one has to analyze themselves and ask the question, what do I expect to
get out of this lathe and how much work (and money) am I willing to put into it?
Many people attracted to lathe/machine work have a high expectation for accuracy
but a low tolerance for the work required to fix them up the and to learn to work
around the idiosyncrasies of these small machines. Those types are better off
getting a new Asian lathe. In the long run, the cost of fixing up an old lathe can
be as much as buying the Asian lathe. It all depends.

I guess you could say that I'm playing "good cop" to Harold's "bad cop." this doesn't
mean either of us is wrong or right. It's just the two sides of the coin.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

[John Evans]

That looks to be a later model with a 1/2 "thick ways because it has the lever that controls the power operation of the cross slide,earlier ones had a button . Also it has the factory underdrive cabnite which is a desirable feature. Wear on the gears in the feed train is not a big issue. It is a 12X36 also. a GOOD cleaning and lubing is a good place to start,don't go pulling it apart willy-nilly . I personaly would just as soon have a Atlas/Craftsman in equal condition to a SB 9 or light 10, as I have used both. Biggest minus to the Atlas is using the half nuts to get the carriage slide feed.

[stevec]

Thanks for the welcome , as for this lathe , its just surface rust nothing serious and yes it went through katrina but was inside a garage so no harm there, i really dont know anything about how to take it apart to fix but i guess i can try , the ways are not beatup or anything like that everything works as far as i know the feed, cross slide, the gear box etc etc , who knows i might give it a try in the future if i dont sell it .

Just my opinion but it appears to me that you don't really have the enthusiasm or mechanical aptitude for a project like this.
I would recomend you sell it to someone more inclined to restore it to the level they require and enjoy it.
Please don't be offended by my take on this, as I said, it's just my opinion.

[Davo J]

Thanks for the welcome , as for this lathe , its just surface rust nothing serious and yes it went through katrina but was inside a garage so no harm there, i really dont know anything about how to take it apart to fix but i guess i can try , the ways are not beatup or anything like that everything works as far as i know the feed, cross slide, the gear box etc etc , who knows i might give it a try in the future if i dont sell it .

Just my opinion but it appears to me that you don't really have the enthusiasm or mechanical aptitude for a project like this.
I would recomend you sell it to someone more inclined to restore it to the level they require and enjoy it.
Please don't be offended by my take on this, as I said, it's just my opinion.

I agree Steve, and also please don't be offended.
There are some guys starting who would be gloating over that lathe if they got it, but you look at keeping it as a second option. As far as I am concerned it would be far better than any Chinese mini lathe to start out on if you did go that way.

If you are interested in using a lathe this is the place to be. No matter how bad it is you can use it to learn on and then step up to something better if you find it's not up to your accuracy level.
Lathes are pretty basic to work on gear wise etc, just don't go taking the headstock off if your not familiar with the proses of putting it back on and aligning it.

Home hobby machining is a great hobby, but you need to want to do it. When you start you can spend many hours making scrap, and even when your experienced you make scrap some times, LOL

Dave

[earlgo]

Sometimes the gears are available on e-bay. For new ones, Boston Gear lists change gears.

The Atlas gears are Zamak as mentioned and take an internal bushing with 2 diametrically opposed keys. I'd not worry that the gear teeth are worn as they will still work. When loaded, they still run OK and provide the proper ratios. They are noisy when not loaded. I have gears on a 1957 Atlas whose teeth look less like involutes and more like pyramids. Still work and so far none of the worn out teeth have broken.
I agree that the flat ways are not as accurate, but a little shimming and adjusting will take care of most of it. Under the carriage on the off side is a row of bolts that hold a clamp plate that has shims under it. Removing/replacing shims will tighten up the carriage some. What is harder to correct is the 'swamp' in the ways from having the carriage run in a general location for many years. Tightening up the carriage so it works in the worn location makes it hard to move in an unworn area. But that is what scrapers are for.
Rebuilding/Cleaning up a machine tool is a great way to learn how it works and what it's limitations are.

As an aside, I have working drawings of the Atlas Model 3983 crossfeed and compound screws and nuts, and the half nuts, if anyone is interested. The 3983 is a 12 x 36.
As a point of interest, in 1971 parts were ordered for this lathe from Atlas Press Co and they were invoiced from the Clausing Co.


--earlgo

[akajun]

Rooster, what part of LA are you in? Im in the Baton Rouge area but travel to north LA a good bit. Anyway I had a lathe like that, the 12 atlas Just without the underdrive cabinet. Mine was basically unused, but had sat up for 30+ years and has some rust spots, but was very mechanically tight.

Those atlas's are just plain noisy, especially in back gear. You can quiet the gears some I found by applying a little grease to the gears to dampen the noise. Other than being dirty, yours looks good enough to use and do accurate work. If you want to sell it , let me know, I know a few people that would be interested nearby.

[rooster]

Thanks alot for the replys , after giveing some thought ill either leave it set in a corner for now or if someone might want to make an offer i cant refuse i would be willing to part with it , i dont really need it , I have another lathe that i use all the time, im close to ville platte louisiana about 35 miles south of Alexandria. Russ (rooster) ( Im not offended by any comments or opinions, im easy to get along with )