I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

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platypus20
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I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by platypus20 »

As the title say, I just bought a Rockwell model 21-100 milling machine, its suppose to be delivered on 5/10/17. Its a small knee mill, with a 6-1/2" x 24" table, 5 spindle speeds, an R8 spindle. I came out of a vocational school, where it had very limited use and then sat sealed up in a shrink wrap, for about 10 years in a warehouse in the city. The owner sold it to me on Tuesday. I'm looking forward to getting it to the shop.
jack
spro
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by spro »

Hello Jack and congratulation.
choprboy
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by choprboy »

Yep, a "3/4 size" mill. It fits nicely in the corner, is far easier to move (somewhere around 600-700lbs as I recall), and can remove a fair amount of metal. My biggest complaint is that it doesn't have a low enough spindle speed. It really needs something down in the 80-100RPM range for running larger parting blades/side mill cutters instead of the 370RPM minimum, can't imagine where I'd ever run the 6300RPM max speed.

The knee crank handle will invariably be broken and welded back together... It always falls off the crank spindle onto the floor with vibration, snapping the casting.
SteveM
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by SteveM »

choprboy wrote:...can't imagine where I'd ever run the 6300RPM max speed.
200 sfpm with a 1/8" mill = 6112 rpm

Many materials need 200 sfpm (with HSS, carbide would be double that).

Steve
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platypus20
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by platypus20 »

I already have a Jet, JVM 836, the Franken-Mill (1940s Bridgeport round ram/mill-drill head) and a Atlas horizontal, the higher hear speed is something I'm lacking, so anything over the 2500 rpm current limit, will be a benefit.

Still trying to decide if I should get a 4" or 5" mill vise, the mill comes with a vise, but it doesn't seem like a good vise, looks more like a drill press vise.

The true benefit to me is the R8 spindle, as the other mills (except the Atlas) are R8, all I really need is a vise.
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SteveM
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by SteveM »

platypus20 wrote:Still trying to decide if I should get a 4" or 5" mill vise, the mill comes with a vise, but it doesn't seem like a good vise, looks more like a drill press vise.... all I really need is a vise.
First, decide whether you want a 4 or 5 (or either). You can get the dimensions on kurtworkholding.com

Create a search on ebay for a used Kurt vise in the size or sizes you want and limit it to a radius you are willing to drive. Shipping on a kurt vise can be a bear, but if you find an ebay seller local to you, you have a huge advantage over someone that needs it shipped.

One thing on 4" vs 5" Kurt vises - the 5" is no longer in production, they are running out of spare parts, parts are expensive and there aren't a lot of people making things like jaws for them. 4" is no problem. The 6" is the best for things like jaws because EVERYONE makes 6" jaws.

Steve
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platypus20
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by platypus20 »

Yeah, it will be a 4" or a 5", but I'd never by another Kurt, especially used, the last 2 I bought used, were worse than any cheap import, you could buy. I'm probably going with either a Glacern, Bison or a South Bend (through Grizzly).
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EOsteam
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by EOsteam »

I bought my 6" Kurt brand vise new during one of Enco's last really great sales. It is a thing of beauty and functions the same. I went from 2 to 3 thousandths error in 6 " to nearly zero. It's made my Taiwan/Chinese Bridgeport clone into a nice machine. Up until the purchase of the Kurt I was regretting buying offshore. It has definitely changed my buying patterns, only quality from here on out.
HJ
SteveM
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by SteveM »

platypus20 wrote:Yeah, it will be a 4" or a 5", but I'd never by another Kurt, especially used, the last 2 I bought used, were worse than any cheap import, you could buy. I'm probably going with either a Glacern, Bison or a South Bend (through Grizzly).
My experience was different than yours. I have four kurts, a pair of fives and a pair of threes, all bought used. Paid $150 for one of the threes and all the rest were $50 or less.

All of them are really good. For what I paid, I couldn't possibly have done better. At some point, I would like to grind the pairs to match, so that I can use them to hold multiple parts or span a part across two vises. If you order a pair from Glacern, you can get them to match.

If I was buying new, Glacern would certainly be on the top of my list. I've heard nothing but good things about them. Bison chucks are top notch. I would expect their vises would be as well.

As to the Grizzly / South Bend, the Glacern is about the same price as the South Bend. Unless I had evidence that they were better than the Glacern, I would lean towards the Glacern.

Steve
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Harold_V
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by Harold_V »

EOsteam wrote:I bought my 6" Kurt brand vise new during one of Enco's last really great sales. It is a thing of beauty and functions the same. I went from 2 to 3 thousandths error in 6 " to nearly zero.
I enjoyed the same experience when I purchased my Kurt 688, delivered, for $327, new, from Enco. I had recently included a Haas toolroom mill in my shop and had need for a second vise.
Up until the purchase of the Kurt I was regretting buying offshore. It has definitely changed my buying patterns, only quality from here on out.
My first Kurt, purchased well over 45 years ago, was to replace a virtually new Bridgeport vise, which was not capable of holding the restrictive squareness tolerance on a production job (implying that items made in the orient are not the sole problem). The Kurt handled the requirement in stride, and has been a dead reliable vise that has remained trouble free and precise.
I am not going to suggest that Kurt is the only quality vise on the market, but to dismiss them because of experiences with vises that likely have cheated the melting furnace isn't really a fair judgment.

Harold
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spro
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by spro »

Good info about the vises. Something else is bugging me. Sometimes it doesn't work to where it gets to that. There is something else like an upper support to were that machine cannot over tilt. The base is solid but of not wide platform. The weight is atop. When ever it looks simple, it is not. Treat it like gold when there are different angles of unload. It may twist. The table weight may twist it at an angle. Have another point that you rope up around ties ,even rafter ties as backup. Something and it may take more time but remember that table had never whacked cement or heavy machinery before and it didn't need to start then.
spro
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Re: I just Bought A Rockwell 21-100 Milling Machine

Post by spro »

In a way I wanted to delete the previous reply. A friend of mine was removing the pallet from under a vertical mill. It had shipped long distance to where it was in his garage. It was similar in weight distribution and he had an engine hoist to support it but it twisted at some point when the pallet was being pulled away. The hoist was over extended and flipped. Bad scene.
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