Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Discussion on all milling machines vertical & horizontal, including but not limited to Bridgeports, Hardinge, South Bend, Clausing, Van Norman, including imports.

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H&NERY
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by H&NERY » Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:32 pm

Here are a few more pictures.
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spro
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by spro » Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:08 pm

OKAY! this is very cool and very clean. This is early with the two elevation screws and by your picture we can see it. Not two long afterwards there was one compound screw (whole different subject). So did you bring it back or what? Probably you braced it vertical because there are all those extensions which were probably shimmed right. We can talk about the OA later but you got a peach there.

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H&NERY
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by H&NERY » Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:19 pm

I am working on getting it shipped home, should have it in a week or so.

spro
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by spro » Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:43 pm

You already made the decision and really, where do we find these ? Oh sure a #4 s rusting away like many others did. That is sick and sad in a machine way but they weigh tons. We do what we can do to preserve the lighter examples and you will be surprised.
If it is anything like the Hendy Norton, it has massive bronze conical bearings. These can and have been cleaned up after 50 years. They are adjustable and with correct lube run another 50 yrs in our case. You may see at some point, the mirror finish of some of these elements.
Brown & Sharpe was into precision grinding long before others. but everybody knows that. but it is still cool.

Glenn Brooks
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by Glenn Brooks » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:53 pm

Yes, good for you for picking this up! It strikes me, another reason for the rounded castings and sweet curves built into the castings could be - strength. And to reduce the possibility of stress fractures and casting failures common with castings having sharp edges and corners. Looking at the side photos, the curved arch supporting the table seems like architectural genius-supporting many times it’s weight it total foot pounds of energy directed into the table and column from the work and the cutters, over thousands and thousands of cycles while engaged in the production of parts.

It would be very interesting to know what color the machine was ‘painted’ when new. Any sign of original color lurking about in hidden recesses on the machine?

My turn of the century 22” camelback drill press seems to still have some Gilsonite black, mineral glaze coating adhering to parts of the quill. Which means my DP probably is a model T Ford vintage machine. If you find sign of any Bright primary colors, it may indicate your machine’s age is pre 1900. (1880-1895).

Great find! Enjoy.

Glenn
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Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge

Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....

John Hasler
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by John Hasler » Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:20 am

Glenn writes:
> Yes, good for you for picking this up! It strikes me, another reason for the rounded castings and sweet curves built into the castings could be -
> strength.

Could be, but most likely it's due to the limitations of the available casting technology.

spro
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by spro » Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:40 am

Insofar smelting was cracked B.C. I think the machine was step into a new era. This rapidly changed to other designs within one decade. The black finish is the same as my Hendy Norton or Boyington shaper. There is no evidence of paint having been on either and it isn't required. The castings are just that smooth. I mean, they are not smooth like a painted surface but are slightly stippled. If left outside for ages they would rust but all the slides and steel parts would rust out before that. I could liken that to an iron cylinder block or third member which has never seen paint but there is virtually no corrosive surface rust.
Before getting lost in types of cast iron, yes Glenn. My oldest machine tool is a Federal planer and it IS painted with that pea green. I have no reason to strip it of that.

spro
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by spro » Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:19 am

You see, the cast fixtures were made to hold those gears at a certain level, a certain tail end of the universal dividing head. It has flipped over decades where they were driven from the left or right. You will see that and others must have seen their B&S is finally okay but it is backward. Even the manual adjustment is backward from the drive yours has. So keep an eye out for a UDH which is the correct Size. I was going to say that the included plate is a clue but can't say that. This could all be peppercorn and we've seen machines seeded with inappropriate parts.
No way are you going to place a 12" swing Cincinnati on that table. Hey it is stuff:)

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H&NERY
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by H&NERY » Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:55 am

I haven't seen pictures of all the pieces but a universal dividing head is supposed to be included.

spro
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by spro » Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:41 am

Forgive me for being a little obsessive about this one machine. I have better things to do and they all make my back hurt. Back to the dividing head, it would be great if you got that. It would accept the index plate in the tool crib, no?. Either way, tail or not, proper size. I don't expect anyone to go out and start milling worms and hypoid gears. That would be down the road but if the right UDH appeared at perfect price..stuff happens before I squeeze the trigger because I don't Know what I'm aiming for.
There is again another thing. Arbor or more correctly, over arm /OA supports. It appears that your OA is not original yet there has been work to allow support attachments to it. These are important things for these size mills. They found, early on, tieing the outboard of the knee to the OA was crucial swinging larger cutting wheels.
So if the person has those supports, get them or you may have to make them. The originals are dandy cast iron affairs and so useful for other things-BUT they aren't. They are only for accurate ties to a mill and very strong at That application. Side strength or bending = fracture.

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H&NERY
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by H&NERY » Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:34 pm

That's ok, I'm learning a lot. I'll be a lot smarter once I get this thing home.

RONALD
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Re: Brown & Sharp N0. 1 Milling Machine

Post by RONALD » Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:18 am

I looked thru my B&S catalog collection, and your #1 appears closest to the one in their 1890 "CATALOGUES" and Price Lists, a little paperback that measures 3" wide by 5.5" high, and 205 pages. As you can see by looking at the drawing, yours has lost several items over the last 127 years.

In that catalog, there is also a #1 Plain Mill, the difference between a plain and universal is that the plain table can not be horizontally rotated for spiral milling, and it was cheaper to produce.

In that catalog are also a #3 and #4 Universal, and #'s 1,2,3,5,6,7, Plain Mills, plus a #2 Vertical Mill.

B&S 1890's No.1 1.jpg
B&S 1890's No.1 2.jpg

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