New York Central Streamlined Hudson

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Asteamhead
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by Asteamhead » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:01 am

JBodenmann wrote:Hello My Friends
Here is something you may find useful. When setting up an engine it's always good to have an idea what the axle loadings are, and here is a simple way to do this. In the top photo we have your simple garden variety bathroom scale setting on a floor jack. Under the floor jack is a bit of plywood setting on a 1/2" thick aluminum disc. I use this because as usual, it's what was laying around. Go with what you got. In this second photo we have the jack and scale under the locomotive stand, with a stick going up to the axle that we are weighing. You will have to arrange some pieces of wood on and under the scale to spread the load. I've killed floor jacks doing this before, by not spreading the load on the scale. Lift the jack till the wheels just leave the rails, and then take the reading. Try to arrange things so that both wheels lift just the tiniest bit. You can get very accurate reading this way.

Jack
Hello Jack,
Great idea! What about that scale now missing in your bathroom then :lol: ?
Connecting the boiler to the back frame I followed the same method, which is very similar to that beeing used at the prototype. The boiler will increase its length about 1.5 / 1000 when heated up. Made of SS almost twice that!

Asteamhead
Attachments
A boiler rear side.jpg
Flexible plates between back side of boiler and frame
A scaling rear  143 kg red.jpg
Did it similar but with the whole (half) of the loconotive

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Sat Aug 08, 2015 11:26 am

Hello My Friends
Yes this is the Hudson that Jesse was working on. He did a great job addressing some of the "quirks" of the East Coast-Klamath design and straightened out a few other problems. Jesse was unable to continue with the project. Here are some photos, the top one shows the disc drivers that Jesse made and the brake hangers that were just fitted up along with the rest of the brake rigging. The other photos show progress on the hinges for the round streamlined nose. This nose splits on the vertical centerline and each half hinges outward. The hinges are fully concealed within the streamlining. Fortunately there are some surviving drawings of these parts, the raised vertical ribs, the steel reinforcement castings around the perimeter, the round dome its self, and some of the hinge pieces. No drawings exist for the hinge bit that sticks to the actual smoke box front, but this could be extrapolated from the remaining drawings and the use of some card stock patterns. The top photo shows a drawing for the hinge. One little trick that you may find useful can be seen on the drawing. A copy of the drawing is made and then the dimensions are eliminated with correction fluid (white out). Then a copy of this is made and new dimensions are written in to suit the scale we are working in. This is much faster and easier that making a new drawing. The prototype nose was made of 12 pie shaped 1/8" steel segments formed and welded together. There were steel castings for the vertical raised rib and to reinforce other parts of the nose. The headlamp went with the right hand half of the nose when it was opened. Five bolts held the nose halves closed.
More to come
Jack
Attachments
Brakes.jpg
Hinge1.jpg
Hinge2.jpg
Hinge3.jpg
Hinge4.jpg

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apm
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by apm » Sun Aug 09, 2015 6:42 pm

Hi Jack,

First off thanks for posting on the axle loadings. I am not sure if you are now past the step but any chance you could post a little more details on how you make your leaf springs to fit after you have worked out your axle loadings via your bathroom scale method? I have have been having a terrible time both cutting, drilling and bending 1095 spring steel. I am curious how you do it.

By the way what exactly is the goal of tuning out the axle loadings as you mention there? How do you choose what weight to put on your drivers vs pilot, vs trailing truck, or is the goal to simply keep it more or less balanced?

Thanks

Adam

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:34 pm

Hello My Friends
To answer Adam's questions, the leaf springs were already made. The engine needed more weight on the drivers and less on the leading and trailing trucks. So instead of changing the lengths of the shackles the driver springs were dis assembled and squirted through the slip rolls to arch them and give more downward force. A couple of the shackles still had to be re made. This is just normal when fiddling with spring rigging. Jesse would have done this but just ran out of time. As to axle loadings, models are not quite the same as the prototype. On the full size engines it's necessary to spread out the weight over all the axles quite evenly so as not to over stress the track, and probably the locomotive frame also. On a model this is not the case. We want more weight on the drivers and much less on the lead and trailing trucks, only enough to help guide the engine and keep all the wheels on the track.
Jack

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Fri Aug 14, 2015 1:00 am

Hello My Friends
Here is something you may find interesting. The domed front of the prototype Streamliner under construction and opened up. The streamlining is not quite complete as the upper part of the pilot is not in place. You can see the backsides of the vertical ribs and how the headlamp goes with one side. In another book I have the same photo, only reversed. In the other book the headlamp stays with the left hand side….Evidently in one photo the negative was upside down. Which to use? I know which is correct, as the smoke box door hinges are actually on the right, not on the left, as in this photo. Well anyway you can see how the vertical rib split down the middle and was made of steel castings. The hinges for the domed front were quite a puzzle, as they are fully concealed when the front is closed. Quite a bit of fiddling about was required to get them right. Here is a photo of them. The hinge on the left is pictured as it would be in the closed position. It also has bosses for the actual smoke box door pivot pins. You can see these hinge straps on the left side of the smoke box door in the photo. The curved surface on the left of the hinge is where it meets the rear curved edge of the dome. The hinge on the right is shown as it would be when the domed front is opened, it has no bosses for smoke box door hinges. A delightful little puzzle…?
See you in the funny pages..
Jack
Attachments
Hudson Smoke BoxOpen.jpg
Hinges.jpg

Mike Walsh
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by Mike Walsh » Fri Aug 14, 2015 5:48 am

I would suggest using the photo as depicted in this photo. If you look at the coupler, you can see the air hose on the right hand side of the photo, or the LH side of the coupler, as facing a car you're about to couple up to.

Compare this to the photo of the opposite view, if you can, and see if you can see the coupler.

Just a thought.

Mike

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Sandiapaul
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by Sandiapaul » Fri Aug 14, 2015 6:46 am

Jack,
The pic you posted above is reversed, note the position of the coupler knuckle. NYC was peculiar in that they had the air hose on the "wrong" side. I tried in vain to find a pic I have seen showing a streamlined Hudson running without the nose after an accident.

Paul

Mike Walsh
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by Mike Walsh » Fri Aug 14, 2015 10:35 am

Woof. You got a better eye than I!

-Mike

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Sat Aug 15, 2015 7:44 pm

Hello My Friends
Here is something you may find useful. The Hudson is now getting to the fun bits. The suspension and boiler mounts are finished up. The front of the smokebox and pilot are always something fun. It's the locomotives face after all, which is twice the fun on this engine as it essentially has two fronts. The actual smoke box front, and then the streamlined one that covers it up. First up, the actual smoke box front. Some straps were needed for the door hinges, about .100" thick and 3/8" wide. This .100" material seems just right for a lot of things on a model in our scales, 1/8" just seems too thick sometimes. So here is a little trick. In this first photo we have a bit of .100" material laying on the band saw. I have my local steel guys shear me off pieces 10" wide and four feet long, in both .100" and .090" thick steel. Ten inches is the widest piece that will fit in my horizontal band saw. I can put these in the bandsaw and slice off strips as wide as I like, as you can see in photo #2. A vise grip is used to hold things down. Photo #3 shows our little strip, sliced off just as neat as you please, very handy for our models. If you look at the photo of the prototype you will see that there are two straps on the main smoke box front, one is straight and one is curved. The inside radius of the strap is 11/16" so a 1-3/8" Dia. disc was stuck down to the steel table and used to bend the curve. A clamp was arranged to hold one end, it was then heated and bent around the disc.
Attachments
SMKBX Strap1.jpg
SMKBX Strap2.jpg
SMKBX Strap3.jpg
SMKBX Strap Hinge1.jpg
SMKBX Srtap Hinge 2.jpg
Last edited by JBodenmann on Thu Aug 20, 2015 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:10 pm

And here is the little strap after bending. To my way of thinking this method is much easier than cutting a curved strap out of a sheet of steel. But how you make a part isn't near as important as that you DO make a part. Get R' Done, go with what you got and all that! If you look close you can see that it was pushed around the disc with a stick until it lined up with a mark on the table made with a silver pencil. And finally we have something cool to look at. The smoke box front with the strap hinges in place. Some bosses were silver soldered to the ends of the straps and they pivot on the hollow bosses previously stuck into the fireman's side dome hinge. Now to make some more strap hinges and smoke box door dogs with which to stick on the small smoke box door that fills up that round hole in the middle. There will be 12 dogs with #4-40 studs and nuts. One more thing, most of them studs and nuts holding the rectangular door on are dummies. Every fourth one or so is an actual stud. The rest are just shorties threaded into the door, these have brass studs with steel nuts. The actual studs that hold the door closed are stainless with brass nuts. This is done for two reasons. It's always good to make the nuts of softer material than the studs. That way if something strips it will be the nut instead of the stud….The second reason is that all the dummy studs with their steel nuts will be painted black. The brass nuts will be left brass. This way when you go to open up the smoke box front you can easily see which nuts must be removed. More to come.
Happy Model Building
Jack
Attachments
SMKBX Strap Hinge 3.jpg
Front 1.jpg

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:26 pm

Hello My Friends
Here is a bit of an update on the Streamliner. Often our models will have a straight boiler with a tapered jacket so as to look like their big sisters. There are several ways to do this, here is one. Some rings were made up from 1/8" X 1" hot rolled. They were cut to length and zoomed through the slip rolls. Then some stand offs were welded on. The front two spacer rings are concentric with the smoke box. The other three rings towards the fire box are not concentric. They have larger spacers at the top and smaller at the bottom. You can see this in the middle photo. There are two #5-40 stainless allen screws that draw the spacer ring up tight around the boiler. The bottom photo shows the rings on the boiler, and also the smoke box front with the small round 4" door with it's studs, dogs, and hinges. Really fun little bits to make.
Attachments
SpacerRing1.jpg
SpacerRing2.jpg
Front&Rings.jpg

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JBodenmann
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Re: New York Central Streamlined Hudson

Post by JBodenmann » Wed Aug 19, 2015 10:06 pm

Now that the spacer rings are in place on the boiler, and the diameter and shape of the boiler jacket has been determined it's time to start on the forms for the back head and throat sheet wrappers. These form tools will be made of MDF, "medium density fiberboard", the copper work pieces will be clamped to them and beat into submission with our old friend the rawhide mallet. All that was laying around was 3/4" MDF and something thicker was needed, so two thicknesses were glued together. Top photo shows these two bits glued together with some scribbles on them defining the outer edges of the wrapper, and where the saw cuts should be. Second photo down shows them after two trips through the table saw. The angle of the bend in the throat sheet is about 33 degrees. So the saw blade was leaned over 16 degrees or so and the two cuts are made. Now the middle piece is flipped over to achieve the 33 degree kick in the wrapper that we want, and the whole mess is clamped and glued together. Tomorrow after the glue has set up the form will get some attention from a round over bit and the router. This form tool will form the rounded vertical corners of the throat sheet which will be 1/16" copper. There is another form tool to be made that will form the curved lip on the upper edge of the wrapper. This lip will fit up against the rear most spacer ring on the boiler, the one right in front of the fire box. Then the boiler jacket will fit against it. I'll post more photos as it all comes together. Too much fun!
Jack
Attachments
Form1.jpg
Forms2.jpg
Forms3.jpg
Forms4.jpg

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