Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

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Cary Stewart
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by Cary Stewart » Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:53 pm

There is another clue as to the original owner of that engine. Look at his cap. Attached to the front is one of the original LALS members badges that were made by one of the members in the mid 1960s. Bruce Ward had one and he joined in 1965.
Cary

tyleire
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Location: North Hollywood, CA

Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:30 pm

Well it's unanimous. The boiler will come off. Thanks for the input guys.
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Looks like the Allen mogul smoke box splits in top and bottom halves with a row of stainless steel screws which will be handy to access steam lines and the two bolts connecting the boiler/smoke box. Though they look to be made out of ss, they don't seem to budge right now, probably due to corrosion.

Meanwhile, the boiler jacket has been cut, rolled and fits pretty well to my surprise, considering I eyeballed most of the measurements and cut the whole thing with a cutoff saw.
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tyleire
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:43 pm

Boiler successfully removed with the help of some friends at LALS. It was determined that the valve rod bell crank broke due to the stress of the valve rod being positioned too close to the vertical brace that holds the crosshead braces (not sure what it's called). It would slam into the vertical brace thus eventually breaking the linkage. Some silver soldering and machining later by the talented Ray Burden solved the problem by repositioning the bell cranks. We followed that up with a check of the timing. Now she's ready to be cleaned and painted.

Cleaning all these nooks and crannies is no easy task. I'm beginning to think disassembling the chassis might have sped up the process quite a bit. This feels like the home stretch though and I'm excited to get through it and start painting.
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tyleire
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:44 pm

Work has been progressing steadily. I made the decision to switch the paint from satin to semi gloss black. The satin just wasn't exciting enough and didn't feel like painted metal to me, and since the locomotive isn't exactly prototypical, I figured I might as well make it shine instead of a sooty black. 10 cans of paint later, the tender has been repainted as well as the locomotive chassis and most of the removable parts on the engine. I painted the cab interior green for fun, which proved to be a bit of a pain to keep masked properly (I understand now why a lot of Allen Moguls I've seen don't do this). The drive rods are painted 'cast aluminum' which I'm not a fan of. It looks like an amusement park ride. After I get the engine assembled, I'll figure out how to pull the rods and get them matte nickel plated as per Steve Alley's suggestion.

The smokebox saddle has some issues. If you look at the locomotive from the side, the smokebox tilts downward, looking more closely it appears corrosion took over beneath the seat of the smokebox where it joins the boiler, expanded and lifted some of the bolts straight up into the cast iron. Replacing it means taking the whole chassis apart, and repairing it might open a can of worms too. I might tackle this job at some point in the future and just try to get the locomotive running for now.

At this point I'm assembling as much as I can to see how it all fits together before final paint and assembly. Those worm gear straps work great for cinching the lagging together.
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Bill C
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by Bill C » Fri Sep 16, 2016 7:51 pm

Hi Ty,

Great job on the new boiler jacket! That is the next item for me to do on my Mogul. Looks like you used one piece of steel, is that right? Is it stainless? What gauge did you use?

Thanks!
Bill C.

tyleire
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Location: North Hollywood, CA

Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Wed Sep 21, 2016 12:38 am

Bill C wrote:Hi Ty,

Great job on the new boiler jacket! That is the next item for me to do on my Mogul. Looks like you used one piece of steel, is that right? Is it stainless? What gauge did you use?

Thanks!
Bill C.
Thanks! No it's cold rolled 18 gauge. I chose thicker to prevent denting, but if I had to do it over again I'd probably go a bit thinner like 20 gauge or even 22ga, because the thicker stuff isn't very pliable when making everything fit and seems like overkill unless you're trying to tap it or something.

tyleire
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Location: North Hollywood, CA

Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:24 pm

Pulled everything apart to figure out what's going on with the tilting smokebox. Discovered a bunch of corrosion at the rear, so I pulled out the wire wheel to clean it off and found this little surprise. Someone at my club suggested filling it with JB weld and drilling a new hole to the right of it where the metal is more intact. The whole saddle probably needs to be replaced soon, but not before I get it running...hopefully.

I'm trying to find a good high heat gasket material to place in the saddle before I bolt the smokebox back on. Anyone have any recommendations?
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FLtenwheeler
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by FLtenwheeler » Wed Sep 21, 2016 7:27 pm

Is that an aluminum casting? Mine is cast iron.

Tim
He who dies with the most unfinished projects: Should of put more time into their hobby.

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cbrew
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by cbrew » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:50 am

tyleire wrote:Pulled everything apart to figure out what's going on with the tilting smokebox. Discovered a bunch of corrosion at the rear, so I pulled out the wire wheel to clean it off and found this little surprise. Someone at my club suggested filling it with JB weld and drilling a new hole to the right of it where the metal is more intact. The whole saddle probably needs to be replaced soon, but not before I get it running...hopefully.

I'm trying to find a good high heat gasket material to place in the saddle before I bolt the smoke box back on. Anyone have any recommendations?
what does the smoke box look like over that void? if it was me, I would just run the bead of permatex on the inside edge of the mating surface and bolt it up,
I have used the red permatex is high heat areas with good success.
http://www.permatex.com/products/gasket ... ne-gasket/

progress looks great btw!
If it is not live steam. its not worth it.

[url=http://chris.brewfamily.info][color=red][u][b]Visit my website here.[/b][/u][/color][/url]

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NP317
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by NP317 » Thu Sep 22, 2016 9:56 am

The smokebox and saddle ideally will fit without a gasket. Then heat can transfer to the cylinders to help keep them at operating temperature.
That's prototypical.
But if a gasket is required to prevent air leaks, follow cbrew's advice.
~RN

Glenn Brooks
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Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by Glenn Brooks » Fri Sep 23, 2016 11:46 am

For a permanent fix, no need to replace the casting. Cast Iron Repair, in Smokey Point, Washington can fill the corroded part with a cast iron welding/brazing process good as new. I've had several cast parts repaired by the owner and they came back looking perfectly new. He uses cast iron filler to fill voids and blaze broken pieces back together again. Can't tell it was ever damaged sfterwards. Only thing is the fellow running the place is in his 70's. I suspect he will retire pretty soon. Then, no telling if this service will even exist anymore.

Glenn
Moderator - Grand Scale Forum

Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge

Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....

tyleire
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Location: North Hollywood, CA

Re: Restoring a modified Allen 2-4-0 barn find

Post by tyleire » Thu Oct 06, 2016 5:27 pm

Good to know it doesn't need a gasket. Thanks gentlemen. I went ahead and bolted it back on and with the corrosion gone from the base, the smokebox doesn't tilt down anymore and looks a whole lot better.

I decided to try firing up at the LALS fall meet last weekend, so I spent 2 days assembling as much as I could, finishing up the grates and ash pan and using good old baling wire to secure various things to the engine temporarily. Took about an hour to get to 40 psi. Looking in the firebox, the coals completely blocked the lower 2 rows of flues - and that was a thin layer. It became pretty clear that building the ash pan so high up into the firebox to clear the eccentrics presented a big problem once the grates were installed. Then soon the ash pan filled in a very short time with its small capacity, quickly blocking air flow and creating another problem due to those damn eccentrics. I'm really curious how Art Laidlaw managed to run on coal with his 2-4-0. I'm out of ash pan design ideas.

It seems to me (and to those helping me fire up last weekend) that the best solution for the time being is to try an oil burner or propane. I'm leaning more towards oil as I've heard propane requires a good bit of vertical clearance as well for the burners.

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