Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine shop

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warmstrong1955
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by warmstrong1955 »

Really looking forward to "how ya did it' posts Dave!

As a guy that worked many remote jobs, and improvised so many fixes.... without the right tools, without the right parts, and without the right material.... I know it's amazing what can really be done!
And....done well!

:)
Bill
Today's solutions are tomorrow's problems.
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

It depends on your view of 'done well'. If I truly stick a fork in it, I am a repair hack with limits on source, time, and finish. No apologies. It depends on the overall goal. Paint is cheep, and can cover many sins. In my working life, I painted things with abandon. They looked good, but didnt work better. The paint shop rebuild was always a problem. So, whats the answer? Make it work. Function over beauty. All the mechanicals of a live engine, are beauty in disguise. While models are a literal sewing machine of motion, Live engines are pretty much a motion of power, that clanked, hissed and needed constant care, from a knowing person, that fended for the machine. A union of iron, and person to tend it, for power and work.

Me? I got a broken truck , and dead deer meat in the middle of my motions here. Sorry but LIFE creeps in. I burnt a belt mowing high grass, and thats what it is. So next time, some news and figures about my hobby. Laters.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

OK, as life moves to its speed of dark, I will bore you with some other thoughts on managing information. Apologies to the guys that know, but I am trying to describe a diferent trail, to maybe support the fearful of heart, so here goes.

While we are cleaning castings of bumps and lumps unwanted, we should collect a few things, if we dont already have them. First is a good scale, like the pocket type, some reading glasses or optics of some sort to help us see fine details, and an area with really good light. Ever thread a needle in the dark? Near impossible, so we need a good light in our clear work area for layout. we also need some type of small hammer, and a good prick punch to mark centers as we move along. We can use layout fluid, Dy-chem or similar, or just a BIG magic marker that will allow us to draw thick lines, to be scribed in with our punch (or maybe even a scribe tool :) ) to make our marked as prercise and readable as possible. So as we amble along without prints, you will find yourself boggled by trying to remember the measures and numbers of the things we look at. So, without trying to bury the parts in tiny numbers, you need a worksheet, to sketch the part, and make measurements that are meaningfull for the future days. This is best done on one of those quadrangle ruled notebooks, so we can doodle on those little squares. I find the cost of a coupla those books to be nil compared to their value in future times, as we plan, note, and record our progress, without the failings of memory. Trust me, little squares and fine line marker are your friend, after being away for days (months?) of ordinary chores. It will get you back in the game in a short time.

Along with these simple things, is the need for accurate measure, and the ability to duplicate those measures back to diferent work pieces. If not, your project is probably doomed from the start. A tape measure, is not nearly accurate enough for machine work, and the increment lines too thick. Use a scale. Get in the practice of laying the punch for marking, in the slight groove of the punched scale, and lifting/rolling up on the work to follow the measure precisely. One of those cheapy 3rd grade compasses, have a fair point for scribing, and can be used for transferring measurements from one family part to another. The quality control of our parts to make, starts here with measurement and duplication. While the castings can be buggared and not uniform, what we do cannot be. The essential measurements and center lines, squareness, of what we do must be controlled, or fit and operations will suffer. Using dial calipers, and micrometers, should be second nature. If you are confused how they work, read, and find out, what all the little marks on the mic barrel mean. It will be the difference between beating in a pin, slipping it in, or letting it rattle in. Each has its place, and is fit and finish. Crude work, will do the job, but some time sanding and polishing, can make things jewel-like. I make it run first, then make it pretty, to my standards, and that is a matter of choice for each.

So as this is directed at those that are probably newbies, and non machinists, take heart as many work arounds exist, and without a lot of machine tools, complex things like watches can be built. Failure is admitted, when you give up. Thats what the scrap box is for, the last piece that did not make muster by your judgment. Next piece will show what you learned, and so it goes, unless you abandon your work. That part is all you, like fit and finish, how good does it need to be? As good as you.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
redneckalbertan
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by redneckalbertan »

Enjoying your posts on the build, and your take on things!
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10KPete
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by 10KPete »

Dave, you're a man after my own heart. But you can write sooo much better than I. Keep it up, I love your approach
to life.

Pete
Just tryin'
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

I apologize as, Kamikaze Deer, bad weather, and other life things are getting in the way. When you start a project, you must make and take time, to move forward and get things done. There are lots of excuses for delays, but none for failure of a pet project. So this weekend, Maybe I can post some progress.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
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steamin10
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Location: NW Indiana. Close to Lake Michigan S. tip

Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

On gettin' it done: I have a not quite broken BIG mower deck apart for maintenance, and several flaws are giving me fits. Dropping the deck and blade sharpening reviled the grease zerk is broken from some hard abject getting ballistically rejected. So it takes some monkey motion to go to the next size, and grease that spindle. Zerk .69. Spindle $50. Smart money.

Any way, more to the point, I found a leak (again) in the barn steel roof of the Annex to the garage, put abucket under it, and did some trimming of the truck side frames. More thin slices of cast iron, and attempts at pictures, trimming the foundry trim to a semi finished dimension on the journal pockets.

* As with any other motion, haste makes waste. So as I got a little mentally rushed to get things rolling, I jammed the chinee band saw, and spit the blade off. OK, back on, over tighten, and thump - thump - thump. As usual, the big box store blades are easily chipped, and three teeth are gone. When that happens, trying to work with it only raises your blood pressure from jams, that take more teeth. One must learn the limits of your tools, relax, and have fun. Broken blades, chipped parts, ruined lines, they are all you. Control you before you attempt to control the tool. Impatience is the largest waste of time, and agonizing at times. So with one side frame trimmed rough, I fought through cutting some heavy stock, where the tooth loss would mean less (being cheap), and quit as my fluorescent light died and left me in the cool, wet darkness, and my own shadow. OK, not fun. Go into the warm heated basement, and clean the lathe. I hate cleaning up, but it has to be done at some time, and is less frustrating than being cold and fighting a bad scenario. (lights, dripping roof, cold, bad blade, Phht! It will wait). I have ONLY 3 spare blades, no bulbs, (drill press is out too) and water splashing on the floor and in a bucket that somehow hits my head for slow water torture. In short, we should enjoy our hobby pursuits, and should not add any significant pressure on our lives. Relax, and daydream about the success you desire, dont worry, be happy. Make your hobby work for you. As I look around, I realize my other light fixtures are in the rafters at another site, another undone project. Maybe on the morrow.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

GREMLINS! And I dont mean that icky car. Tried to open the Annex roll up door, and POW!, the right side lifting spring broke at the eye again. Not to be denied, I pulled a blade off the pegboard, thew it on the floor to unravel it, and replace the infuriating toothless one on the band saw. Oops! Wrong length. Belonged to the scrapped saw. So another package from Menards on the wall, and we are rolling again. Now, the trimming on the castings can be done with fine (32) tooth hack saw blades. 32 I have most of, because no matter soft aluminum or cast iron, they will cut with reasonable speed and control. They wont hang up on tubing, and by being patient, and not neanderthal, will last for some time, before dulling out. Pick a heavy duty frame, because I used to gang 3-18 tooth blades together to shape and mill odd blocks of aluminum, with much more carving control than a mere file.

Always have a spare blade for your hack (band) saw. Nothing ruins the day like a broken blade to stop your progress when you are rare'n to go. I have a band saw and use it for speed and power, but the old armstrong hack will do the same job. Just a little work and time.

Trying to get my pic capability back up, so with all the castings de- sprued, I will turn to dressing the raw castings into not so raw castings with a belt sander. I will start playing with dimensions, and softening rough corners for eye appeal. Some filing will be done, as the wide sanding belts cant do it all. Some will go to flap wheels, on an air grinder. (Pawn shop, but new about $20 from china. Many air tools are available at low price, that can aid our job with little cost). Also layered 4 inch sanding discs for that 4.5 inch grinder. I have good ones, but bought a Harbor freight unit for about $18. After putting some real bearing grease in the head gears, it is performing quite nicely on general work.

This is a work in progress, so like a blind man crossing a busy street, we will proceed with caution. I know you are out there, I just cant see you.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
RET
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by RET »

Hi Dave,

Just a suggestion. Buy your band saw blades in 100' coils, cut them to length with a pair of good, heavy tin snips (cut from the back side, not the tooth side), grind the ends for a lap joint and then silver solder the ends together. I've been doing this for years and it works just fine. I have about 3 different blades I generally use, a 3/4" wide skip tooth blade with about 8 teeth per inch for thick material, a 1/2" wide blade with about 14 teeth per inch and a 1/4" fine blade for thin stuff and sharp curves. These three handle most of my needs. My experience is that you need a minimum of two teeth in the work to avoid stripping teeth and a maximum of 10 teeth. If you have more than ten teeth it will still cut, but it takes a lot more force to do the job.

Having blade stock by the coil is cheaper and joining your own blades means you never have to put off a job until you can go to the store (assuming they have the particular blade and length you need).

While I have a fairly complete shop now, it took me years to build it up and we have all started the way you are describing now. I'm sure many will learn from your posts. Keep up the good work and as you say, life often gets in the way. Been there, done that.

Hope this helps a bit.

Richard Trounce.
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

You text lap joint, but I know you mean Butt joint, as the off set of a lap wont pass the guides. I have not used many blades of late, and I have 4 stores in 5 miles that carry fair to middlin' stock blades. Fastenal and other major supply stores are just around the corner for me, so I am spoiled with suppliers. Thanks for the comment.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
6491
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by 6491 »

I believe it would be a tapered lap joint
Have a good one....John.
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steamin10
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Re: Alternate ways. Gettin it done without alot of machine s

Post by steamin10 »

No, welded or brazed, it is a butt joint. It is actually easy to set up in a vice with the blade in cut wood blocks. Torch temp is critical, and needs a bit of skill, but easy to learn.

A Buddy with a Do-All and welder is the best. :wink:
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.
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