Getting (Galloping) Goosed

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rkcarguy
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by rkcarguy » Mon Jan 10, 2022 4:14 pm

If you have power feed on your cross slide, and it looks like you have a good sized lathe, I wouldn't be afraid of the interrupted cut if running carbide.
The only caveat is that with carbide you need a decent chip load to get a nice finish, and that will usually cause some vibration chatter around the holes. Taking a lighter finish cut will eliminate that, but will probably be more dull in finish. That said you could always rough with carbide and then finish cut with a bullnose HSS bit for the best of both worlds.

Harold_V
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by Harold_V » Mon Jan 10, 2022 7:37 pm

I tend to not agree with the use of carbide unless the machine in question is quite robust. Interrupted cuts generally leave telltale signs, a condition badly exacerbated by carbide, especially on light machines. I, too, would have used HSS, which responds to interrupted cuts quite nicely. Slow spindle speed and positive rake with a chip breaker works extremely well.

Drilling holes on sloped surfaces is troublesome, too. The very best scenario, in my mind, would have been to create the sloped surface, then do the holes on a mill with a rotab and an end mill to spot the hole locations. That would eliminate the problem with the slope. Slow business, but it yields great results. Alternately, a guy could use his DRO and eliminate the rotab, or even trig the locations when a DRO isn't an option. Not to suggest that it's the only way---just a good way.

H
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jeanluc83
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by jeanluc83 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:43 pm

The second wheel is roughed out. I used my die filer to clean up the bur left on the inside of the holes from the interrupted cut. It worked really well.

Right now the plan is to make the axle then turn the wheel treads while on the axle. It will save having to make a mandrel.

20220115_144110_resize_46.jpg
Roughed out wheels
20220115_143557_resize_20.jpg
Cleaning up the inside of the holes on one of the wheels

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rmac
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by rmac » Mon Jan 17, 2022 4:17 pm

jeanluc83 wrote: The biggest advantage was for the hole layout. It was nice to have the flat face to work on.

If I had the option a rotary table in the mill would have been the best. It would have also been nice to clean up the holes using a boring head. I'm not sure that either option would be any faster.
When you say "a rotary table in the mill would have been the best", do you mean best for locating the holes, or best for machining the recess?

-- Russell Mac

jeanluc83
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by jeanluc83 » Mon Jan 17, 2022 8:29 pm

I would use a rotary table to locate the holes but triging out the coordinates would be next choice. A digital readout would make the job even easier.

The recess could be done in a mill but, on a manual machine at least, my preference would be a lathe. If I had access to a CNC machine things might be different.

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rmac
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by rmac » Tue Jan 18, 2022 7:25 am

jeanluc83 wrote: I would use a rotary table to locate the holes but triging out the coordinates would be next choice. A digital readout would make the job even easier.
Got it! Thanks.

As it happens, just the other day I made a flywheel that's very similar (seven lightening holes, even!) to your wheels. I have a rotary table, but no DRO. For me, it's easier do let the CAD program do the trig than to set up the rotary table. Then when drilling the holes, I check everything about eight times and try not to get distracted or forget about backlash.

Sounds great, right? Don't tell anyone that I managed to grab the wrong drill (too big, of course) for the axle hole and had to fix it by pressing in a plug and redrilling.

-- Russell Mac

flywheel.png

rkcarguy
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by rkcarguy » Tue Jan 18, 2022 2:32 pm

jeanluc83 wrote:
Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:43 pm
The second wheel is roughed out. I used my die filer to clean up the bur left on the inside of the holes from the interrupted cut. It worked really well.

Right now the plan is to make the axle then turn the wheel treads while on the axle. It will save having to make a mandrel.


20220115_144110_resize_46.jpg

20220115_143557_resize_20.jpg
This is a good way to go. The wheels don't always press on the axles perfectly straight. I've been roughing my wheel profiles and finish reaming the axle holes, then press them onto the axle and finish turn all the tread and flange tapers/angles.
Regarding the holes in a "bolt circle" format, a Bridgeport EZ-Trak works wonders if you have access to one. I no longer do, but I can draw them up in CAD and then dimension them so I can use the manual mill with a DRO. Just remember to "come to" all the dimensions in the same direction to eliminate any backlash in the screws. Personally I work in a CCW rotation on the XY handles with the locks snugged down a little, but it doesn't matter as long as you are consistent.

jeanluc83
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by jeanluc83 » Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:56 am

They could be twins.

I’ll make a confession that I cheated a little with my hole layout. I used CAD to make a paper template then used that to transfer punch the holes. I don’t have any real way of measuring but I would imagine you could get the holes to +/- .005” pretty easily with this method. For something like this that is visual the inaccuracy is not a problem. For other things like bolt patterns, as long as you match drill the pattern you are fine.

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rmac
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by rmac » Wed Jan 19, 2022 10:28 am

jeanluc83 wrote: They could be twins.
Indeed!
jeanluc83 wrote: I'll make a confession that I cheated a little with my hole layout. I used CAD to make a paper template then used that to transfer punch the holes. I don't have any real way of measuring but I would imagine you could get the holes to +/- .005? pretty easily with this method
Not cheating! I do that all the time, especially on the woodworking side of the shop where that .005" is pretty much meaningless. One thing I've noticed is that my ink jet printer makes much more accurate templates than my laser printer. I'm not sure if that's true for all printers everywhere, but it's worth a check to make sure your printer is actually doing what you think it is.

When I want to get fussy and use CAD, I pick a convenient point somewhere as a datum and then dimension all the features from that point. In the case of the flywheel, the datum was the corner of the raw stock that I started with:

flywheel_drawing.png

Then, since my despicable mill/drill has 8 TPI lead screws, I use a spreadsheet to convert all the raw dimensions into dial-turns-plus-remainder format (2.359" = 18 turns + 0.109", e.g.) so I don't get totally confused when I'm setting the dials.

If I ever get another mill, it will have a DRO.

-- Russell Mac

jeanluc83
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by jeanluc83 » Wed Jan 19, 2022 7:45 pm

It has been a long time since I've single point threaded in the lathe. It was also the first time threading in a lathe without a quick change gear box so it took a bit to get the change gears set up right. I was able to get both ends of the axle threaded without any issues.

After I had the axles threaded I cut the keyways using my Atlas mill. The keyways in the wheels were broached in the lathe shaper style.

I need to make a couple of 1/8" spacers then I can turn the treads.

20220119_164413_resize_89.jpg
Axle threaded and keyways cut

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NP317
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by NP317 » Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:54 am

Looking successful!
RussN

jeanluc83
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Re: Getting (Galloping) Goosed

Post by jeanluc83 » Thu Jan 27, 2022 9:03 pm

My rear wheels are finally done.

For machining the tread I made a spreadsheet of cut lengths that follow the IBLS wheel contour. Once done a quick clean up with a file was all that was needed. It worked fairly well. I used the same method on the front wheels.

20220127_185950_resize_17.jpg
Wheels done
20220123_161811_resize_43.jpg
Tread profile before cleaning up with a file
20220121_191528_resize_93~3.jpg
Wheel outside profile
20220127_190057_resize_45~3.jpg
Inside profile

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