12" working railroad
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 12:36 pm
I'm a noob here, 2nd post!
I purchased some land last year and am in the process of getting a small home put on it in Washington State.
I've always been into trains since I was a kid, and had initially...and I may still, planned on putting up a pole building and re-erecting my HO scale layout in the upstairs.
The land I purchased is heavily treed. I'll have wood heat in the house and will be dealing with firewood on a regular basis. Plus, the driveway is about 250' long and my lower back is not going to endure dragging a garbage can up and down it, or lifting it up and down from the back of my truck. Initially I started looking for a utility type 4-wheeler, then the light bulb came on in my head....it's time for the firewood and garbage express!
Feasibility:
My lot has some decent slope to it, so I was concerned with the grades I had to deal with. Initial "survey" said 5% which isn't going to work.
Through google earth, I was able to create a path, save it, and "view elevation profile", and through some trial and error come upon a route that will yield less than 3.5% grades. So this will work, but I'll need some good motive power and traction obviously....and good brakes!
Background:
I started life as a machinist, expanded into fabrication and carpentry, and now after a back injury I'm in management for a contractor who also has a fab and machine shop. I've got welders, belt sander, band saw, table saw, chop saw, torch, grinders, plenty of tools at home, and also have limited access to the equipment at work.
The plan:
Start near the end of the driveway at the road and wind my way south, to what will end up being a backwards S-shaped route with a reversing loop on each end and about 800' of track total. Like any layout it will probably grow from there haha!
I settled upon 12" gage because I wanted to move some weight and have a stable(wide) track for doing so. Utilization of the various small motors and car parts I have laying around also fit the best within a larger scale. Track will be a "groovy track" type design with grooves cut in 2x4's with flat bar laid on end. Additionally, I decided I want to weld washers to the flat bar rails and screw every tie to the rail as I plan on moving some real weight. I have wholesale availability of steel, wood, and lots of scrap to sort through for freebies, so this makes the most sense.
Motive power:
My first locomotive will be an Old Milwaukee Baldwin S-12. These used to run here when I was young, and it's boxy shape will make it fairly easy to model. I have already purchased 8ea 4 bolt flange bearings, 1" shaft material, and a "variety box" of good quality 520 chain and sprockets from a motorcycle shop that is closing(retiring). Having been into go karts in the past, I have a couple of the 7HP 212cc predator engines still new in the box, plus a 420cc predator that has been modified to around 18HP and 20lbs of torque. I've got centrifugal clutches kicking around that fit both engines.
Drive options:
The body of the S-12 will fit the 212cc motors, but the 420cc engine would only fit inside the cab. I had initially planned on truck mounting both 212cc engines inside the body with double gear reduction chain drives about 18:1, yielding about 5mph @ ~3000 rpm and 245 ft/lbs of torque at the axles figuring 20% loss. But, I've got to conjure up some kind of reverse mechanism x 2. Plus each engine will need a centrifugal clutch on it and the slippage could be a concern, although I don't expect it to be at such a low speed and gear ratio. 14 tooth sprockets(there was a bunch of them in the box) will be put on all 4 axles so they will all be driven, then a 30T will be placed on two of the axles with a 13T driving it from the "topside" on each truck at a 2.3:1 ratio. From there, a 12/88 ratio (7.33:1)would be used from the engine in #35 chain. I have everything I need except the 88T sprockets, and some sort of reverse.
Option B, would be to cab mount the 420cc engine and use hydraulics, but I'm at a loss of how to size the pump and motors and would love some insight there, the resulting "fluid gear ratio" and so on. Reverse would be easy though, as would the mechanics with only hoses going to each truck. I'd have to purchase all the hydraulics and they seem to be quite expensive though. FYI, I'm forecasting the locomotive to weigh around 600#'s, probably 140#'s per piece of rolling stock(3 cars max), and have about 500#'s of load capacity in each car.
I will also run a Honda Civic alternator(I have several) and a battery so I can run accessories.
Due to the weight I want to move, I have ruled out gas-electric due to cost of the electric motors and drives.
For brakes, I'm planning on using rear disc brake calipers so I have the options of hydraulic, mechanical(e-brake cables and handle/linkage), and air over hydraulic. I figure using 1 per truck on the locomotive and one per piece of rolling stock.
Sorry for the long post, just wanted to get all the details out there so you guys could shoot some holes in them:)
I purchased some land last year and am in the process of getting a small home put on it in Washington State.
I've always been into trains since I was a kid, and had initially...and I may still, planned on putting up a pole building and re-erecting my HO scale layout in the upstairs.
The land I purchased is heavily treed. I'll have wood heat in the house and will be dealing with firewood on a regular basis. Plus, the driveway is about 250' long and my lower back is not going to endure dragging a garbage can up and down it, or lifting it up and down from the back of my truck. Initially I started looking for a utility type 4-wheeler, then the light bulb came on in my head....it's time for the firewood and garbage express!
Feasibility:
My lot has some decent slope to it, so I was concerned with the grades I had to deal with. Initial "survey" said 5% which isn't going to work.
Through google earth, I was able to create a path, save it, and "view elevation profile", and through some trial and error come upon a route that will yield less than 3.5% grades. So this will work, but I'll need some good motive power and traction obviously....and good brakes!
Background:
I started life as a machinist, expanded into fabrication and carpentry, and now after a back injury I'm in management for a contractor who also has a fab and machine shop. I've got welders, belt sander, band saw, table saw, chop saw, torch, grinders, plenty of tools at home, and also have limited access to the equipment at work.
The plan:
Start near the end of the driveway at the road and wind my way south, to what will end up being a backwards S-shaped route with a reversing loop on each end and about 800' of track total. Like any layout it will probably grow from there haha!
I settled upon 12" gage because I wanted to move some weight and have a stable(wide) track for doing so. Utilization of the various small motors and car parts I have laying around also fit the best within a larger scale. Track will be a "groovy track" type design with grooves cut in 2x4's with flat bar laid on end. Additionally, I decided I want to weld washers to the flat bar rails and screw every tie to the rail as I plan on moving some real weight. I have wholesale availability of steel, wood, and lots of scrap to sort through for freebies, so this makes the most sense.
Motive power:
My first locomotive will be an Old Milwaukee Baldwin S-12. These used to run here when I was young, and it's boxy shape will make it fairly easy to model. I have already purchased 8ea 4 bolt flange bearings, 1" shaft material, and a "variety box" of good quality 520 chain and sprockets from a motorcycle shop that is closing(retiring). Having been into go karts in the past, I have a couple of the 7HP 212cc predator engines still new in the box, plus a 420cc predator that has been modified to around 18HP and 20lbs of torque. I've got centrifugal clutches kicking around that fit both engines.
Drive options:
The body of the S-12 will fit the 212cc motors, but the 420cc engine would only fit inside the cab. I had initially planned on truck mounting both 212cc engines inside the body with double gear reduction chain drives about 18:1, yielding about 5mph @ ~3000 rpm and 245 ft/lbs of torque at the axles figuring 20% loss. But, I've got to conjure up some kind of reverse mechanism x 2. Plus each engine will need a centrifugal clutch on it and the slippage could be a concern, although I don't expect it to be at such a low speed and gear ratio. 14 tooth sprockets(there was a bunch of them in the box) will be put on all 4 axles so they will all be driven, then a 30T will be placed on two of the axles with a 13T driving it from the "topside" on each truck at a 2.3:1 ratio. From there, a 12/88 ratio (7.33:1)would be used from the engine in #35 chain. I have everything I need except the 88T sprockets, and some sort of reverse.
Option B, would be to cab mount the 420cc engine and use hydraulics, but I'm at a loss of how to size the pump and motors and would love some insight there, the resulting "fluid gear ratio" and so on. Reverse would be easy though, as would the mechanics with only hoses going to each truck. I'd have to purchase all the hydraulics and they seem to be quite expensive though. FYI, I'm forecasting the locomotive to weigh around 600#'s, probably 140#'s per piece of rolling stock(3 cars max), and have about 500#'s of load capacity in each car.
I will also run a Honda Civic alternator(I have several) and a battery so I can run accessories.
Due to the weight I want to move, I have ruled out gas-electric due to cost of the electric motors and drives.
For brakes, I'm planning on using rear disc brake calipers so I have the options of hydraulic, mechanical(e-brake cables and handle/linkage), and air over hydraulic. I figure using 1 per truck on the locomotive and one per piece of rolling stock.
Sorry for the long post, just wanted to get all the details out there so you guys could shoot some holes in them:)