Train Insurance

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Chris Hollands
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Train Insurance

Post by Chris Hollands » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:36 pm

My insurance broker (who is a Welsh train man) came to me yesterday and said the insurance company wants me to insure it as a separate item and wants a valuation , problem is who do you get that could value it and be acceptable to the insurance company , I have no idea but I'm sure someone does .
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ccvstmr
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by ccvstmr » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:58 pm

Chris...years ago (like 20), had a guy in my club that built a 1" scale DM&IR Yellowstone (think it was featured in Live Steam Mag). Somehow he was able to value the loco at $115k. Don't remember how he arrived at that value.

1st...consider yourself lucky you have an insurance company willing to provide protection for your hard work. Care to share the insurance company name with other board readers? This has been an ongoing problem here in the states.

2nd...while you may or may not find another replica of your locomotive, the best you might be able to do is find other locomotives of near quality and alevel of detail and find out what those were valued at. Check for ads in Ebay or other on-line hobby RR equipment sales. Check with museums. The hard part is going to be putting a value on the time invested to create such a miniature locomotive.

Wish you luck. Let us know what you find out. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!

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Trainman4602
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Trainman4602 » Mon Jan 04, 2016 1:41 am

HI Chris

Back in the day when Mercer Locomotive was building locomotives for customers I was asked to do a few of these evaluations for builders that either wanted to insure there locomotive or donated it to a museum so they could wright it off on there taxes.

I would contact several builders such as Wayne Godshall in PA. Currently his company Godshall Custom Machining is building a UP big Boy and has finished a UP Challenger as well.

Wayne would know best the cost and worth of such a project.
ALLWAYS OPERATING MY TRAIN IN A SAFE MANNER USING AUTOMATIC AIR BRAKES

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Bill Shields
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Bill Shields » Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:35 am

hang on to wallet.

anything as valuable as that loco that can be 'walked away with'....especially if you are going to leave it at a club 'storage area' rather than transport for every use.

I can imagine the 1000's of questions the insurance company will ask -> and not like the answers they will receive.

This coming from a farmer who just had his homeowner's insurance doubled (from $2400 to in the excess of $4500 / year) because we are 5.8 miles from the fire house as opposed to their 'standard' of 5.0 miles....as if the 0.8 miles of straight country road with no stop signs or traffic / lights REALLY makes a difference to anyone except the bean counters. :lol: :shock:
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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FLSTEAM
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by FLSTEAM » Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:39 am

Just join NMRA. They will insure your engine. Just follow their website.

Collection Insurance
This service offers NMRA members group property insurance for
collections, layouts, live steam, tools, slides and photographs, books,
magazines, railroad memorabilia, and more. This insurance also
covers an individual’s property if it resides on a club layout.
Members receive NMRA Group Rates
· Free quote or brochure, contact J.A. Bash & Co.:
1-800-654-2256 or 300 Mt. Lebanon Rd., Ste.225,
Pittsburg, PA, 15234.

John B.
http://www.ngshay.com/
Shay drawings and castings

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ccvstmr
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by ccvstmr » Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:51 am

John, you left out...to get NMRA insurance, you have to be an NMRA member. Still if annual NMRA dues are just over $100/year, that kind of insurance may be the best deal in town.

I went thru something similar with my insurance company years ago. They wouldn't insure the loco or other equipment. Why? Since the equipment was stored on club property, I did NOT have immediate control over the access and security. Even though someone would have to open 3 locks to get any equipment off the property, that wasn't enough to satisfy them. Never did follow up on the NMRA insurance. Something to consider for 2016. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!

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Carrdo
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Carrdo » Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:55 pm

The best insurance is to take lots of pictures of your locomotive as you have done and as well put your S.I.N. number in a hidden place on the engine/tender where only you can find it. It won't stop theft but it would be almost impossible for anyone else to explain how your S.I.N. number got on their locomotive.

But if you need the insurance for fire, flood or damage, that is something else.

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Gary Armitstead
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Gary Armitstead » Tue Jan 05, 2016 1:07 am

About 35 years ago, I wanted to add my 1.5" Allen ten-wheeler and three pieces of rolling stock to my home owners insurance policy as a separate rider to the policy. My agent came up to the house to inspect the equipment and give me the forms to make out and get the appraisal. As soon as I opened the garage door, his jaw dropped. He told me to shut the door. He said if the insurance company knew I had these trains and pulled the public with them, I could lose my insurance because of liability. STILL don't have them insured! :)
Gary Armitstead
Burbank, CA
Member LALS since 1980
Member Goleta Valley Railroad Club 1980-1993

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Greg_Lewis
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Greg_Lewis » Tue Jan 05, 2016 11:08 am

Keep in mind the difference between loss and damage, and liability. I can get coverage for loss/damage while the stuff is home via my homeowners policy, and during transport via my auto coverage. If it's at the club, there is no coverage from my insurance. Whether the club has coverage is a separate question. And there is no liability coverage anywhere that I can find other than the coverage offered to tourist railroads, which is priced far beyond reasonableness.
Greg Lewis, Prop.
Eyeball Engineering — Home of non-interchangeable parts.
Our motto: "That looks about right."
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piedmontg
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by piedmontg » Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:00 pm

Between around 1986 and 1998 or so I had something called Inland Marine insurance. It covered my locomotives and rolling stock for fire, theft, damage, ie basic stuff. It covered it at sites, during travel, and at home. Auto insurance that I could find did not cover the equipment if you were in an accident, covered the vehicle or trailer repairs but not contents. Again I tried to get the contents in writing and was refused. I could not get any homeowners insurance to put in writing that my stuff was covered,even in the shop as personal property, the agents would say it was covered but that ment nothing.

Getting actual liability insurance was an equally challenging issue, went with many companies over the years. Have no idea what it takes today, but I will bet if you think your homeowners covers it, get in writing.
P
For about three or four years starting in 2004 I did get an insurance company to cover in writing my locomotives, model engines, etc. as well as my shop. About 2008 I got letter stating that the locomtives and rolling stock could no longer be covered, I think the reason was they were now classified as vehicals since they moved under there own power, of course they would not issue a vehical coverage. As I was getting out of the hobby and selling my equipment I just let it go.

One other item to consider for liability is an Umbrella Policy. Again get in writing special issues, like track sites, pulling the public, running models on a table at a show. Shows are requiring this if you are not a member.

I do not mean to hastle insurance agents but unless it is in writing or a letter from the underwriter specifically authorizing the agent to write specfics it does not count.

Yes I spent a lot of time on this issue.

Bob

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Bill Shields
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by Bill Shields » Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:04 pm

like I said above...

1000's of questions and no answers you will like unless you have LOTS of $$$$
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

piedmontg
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Re: Train Insurance

Post by piedmontg » Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:57 pm

I agree to a point, its a lot of pictures, writing a description, and then going out and finding a supplier.

As for the cost, that is really a personal decision. You decide what level of insurance against various loss scenerios ie sued for all you have or paying for some doctors bill or whatever. You make the judgement you call the shots.

In our case we went to an average of 15 - 20 events a year. The insurance amount on up to three policies we had were from $800 - $1200 per year, at the end it was going up fast. That worked out to about $75 per event.

We decided it was of value to at least have cover just in case, of course if something got real bad you would still be at risk no matter what insurance you had.

Just a question of where to spend your $$ vs value added. We spent about $17,000 over 20 years or so, never had a claim or any issues. Was it a good investment? Of course we think it was others may feel it was a waste of money.

You need to know the facts about your particular situation, if your homeowners liability policy is at risk because of the hobby you are in, better ask, because after an event is too late, the insurnce company has all the cards - make sure you know what hand you hold.

Knowledge and facts are necessary not just in building a locomotive.

Bob

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