New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

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Berkman
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Berkman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:57 am

NP, what 2.5 scale mikado?


It'd be great to see a Whitepass & Yukon 70 class or any of the EBT Mikados.

If in Texas, go with 7.5 gauge. You could always build a 3.75 scale mikado or 2-8-0. I remember seeing a red 3.75 scale 2-8-0 for sale years ago. I think it is the pacific northwest now.

Transporting something like a K36 or K37 will be a challenge. Some tracks won't have a unloading ramp suitable for a 4000lb locomotive. What happens when it derails? It's hard enough to get a USRA mikado or hudson back on the track sometimes, much less something that weighs 3-4x more.

alco2350
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Location: Houston, Texas

Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by alco2350 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:14 am

I had always planned on 7.5" gauge because that's what is available here. Not sure where the 7.25" idea came from.

Speaking of modeling scales vs. available track gauges. I guess I need to get my eyes on the real thing because I can't really get my head around the size by pictures and youtube video's alone. Berkman, you mention a mike or consolidation in what, 3.75" scale? Would that not be oversized (proportionally speaking) for 7.5" track?

I had not fully considered the weight (2 tons) and whether the club could accommodate. This is why I'm here, to ask these questions and firm up a game plan before I start spending money.

Britt

Berkman
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Berkman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:21 am

Britt,

3.75 scale is a 2ft gauge prototype on 7.5 gauge track. Look up https://www.rmirailworks.com/Sweet_Creek.asp for an example.

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Greg_Lewis
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Greg_Lewis » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:49 am

Berkman wrote: ...
Transporting something like a K36 or K37 will be a challenge. Some tracks won't have a unloading ramp suitable for a 4000lb locomotive. What happens when it derails? It's hard enough to get a USRA mikado or hudson back on the track sometimes, much less something that weighs 3-4x more.
Britt, we're not trying to discourage you; we just want to be sure you understand the requirements of a large loco. I also wanted one of the K series engines and spent some time with a tape measure in my shop getting a feel for how long and how high it would be. Then I went to LALS and rode behind Harry Haas' engine. I had not realized the size of it when you have it all in a 3-D, touchable form. So I then looked at a Northern. I love Northerns. But then I went to a meet were one derailed on the single-track main, just down on the ties, not splayed all over, and it took four guys 45 minutes to get it back on the rails, while holding up the whole railroad. So I backed up again and have an Allen 10-wheeler which can be re-railed by the engineer in a matter of minutes. All this may not be an issue for you, particularly if you don't plan to travel with the engine but keep it at one track, but it is something to think about.
Greg Lewis, Prop.
Eyeball Engineering — Home of non-interchangeable parts.
Our motto: "That looks about right."
Celebrating 30 years of turning perfectly good metal into bits of useless scrap.

alco2350
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Location: Houston, Texas

Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by alco2350 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:42 pm

Greg_Lewis wrote:
Berkman wrote: ...
Transporting something like a K36 or K37 will be a challenge. Some tracks won't have a unloading ramp suitable for a 4000lb locomotive. What happens when it derails? It's hard enough to get a USRA mikado or hudson back on the track sometimes, much less something that weighs 3-4x more.
Britt, we're not trying to discourage you; we just want to be sure you understand the requirements of a large loco. I also wanted one of the K series engines and spent some time with a tape measure in my shop getting a feel for how long and how high it would be. Then I went to LALS and rode behind Harry Haas' engine. I had not realized the size of it when you have it all in a 3-D, touchable form. So I then looked at a Northern. I love Northerns. But then I went to a meet were one derailed on the single-track main, just down on the ties, not splayed all over, and it took four guys 45 minutes to get it back on the rails, while holding up the whole railroad. So I backed up again and have an Allen 10-wheeler which can be re-railed by the engineer in a matter of minutes. All this may not be an issue for you, particularly if you don't plan to travel with the engine but keep it at one track, but it is something to think about.
Not discouraged. I welcome the real world advice and experience from the group. It will keep me from heading down the wrong path and save me from wasted $$$ and effort.

Britt

Pontiacguy1
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Pontiacguy1 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:06 pm

Hey Britt: Something you will need to think some about is not just how you are going to transport this thing, but where are you going to store it. A large 2 1/2" scale narrow gauge locomotive, tender and a caboose is going to take up a lot of real estate just for storage.

If it were me, and you're determined to build in narrow gauge, then I would start out with something smaller than a huge 2-8-2, something maybe with a saddle tank where you can use a gondola or flat car for your riding car. Look at the MEG steam locomotives. They are simple, several have been built, so you know they run good, and you can 'Amercanize' it easily with different domes, stack, cab, couplers, and running boards. Something like that would definitely have a bigger look and feel, would weigh probably about 600 pounds instead of 2000+ pounds, and you could carry both it and a riding car side-by-side in the bed of a pickup truck. It also wouldn't take a whole garage to store it, and when it derails (not if), you can pop it back on the track in a matter of minutes and be back on the move. Type in MEG steam wendy into a search engine to get an idea of what some of them look like and the size.

One more thing: You don't have to re-post everyone's statements when you reply to someone. Anyone reading through the thread can see what you are replying to without taking up a bunch of extra space.

Just my thoughts on what a beginner should be considering.

Berkman
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Berkman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:15 pm

Maybe look for something small to buy second hand just to get a feel for owning a steamer- the transport, storage, maintenance, running etc. Then start building your dream engine.... this way you learn on the smaller one, and have something to run while building the big K etc...

Sell the small one when are finished with the big one.... Or keep it to have something more portable.

Could find an Allen or LE 0-6-0 etc for around 9-14K

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FLSTEAM
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by FLSTEAM » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:46 pm

Britt

I have built 3 engines and it takes a lot more time and money than you can imagine.
The 15" ga. mogul took 8 years and the Shay took 2 years.
A "K" engine is an enormous under taking in any scale and BTW is an enormous engine in 2.5" scale.
If you want big the K is it. If you are not retired just plan on years ahead not months.

John B
http://www.ngshay.com/
Shay drawings and castings

Berkman
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Berkman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:50 pm

This would be a good "starter" engine: https://auctions.discoverlivesteam.com/ ... sra-tender

alco2350
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Location: Houston, Texas

Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by alco2350 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:14 pm

As I do not have the means to outright purchase a used locomotive, I'll have to build one. The last car I built took me six years and an untold amount of cash. I have no issue with the time required, especially as I still work full time (and will until the day I die most likely).

The Meg Wendy looks like a fine loco to start with, especially if it can be americanized. I wonder if it can be modified to accept a pilot truck?

Britt

Miserlou57
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Miserlou57 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:16 pm

The K36 in 2.5” scale is nothing short of a monumental build. One of Tom Miller’s engines is unfathomably large and heavy. It truly weighs in at 4000lbs, and while it occupies just about the size of an RMI engine, it is drastically beefier and larger in most features, except maybe the topmost height. At this weight it may truly be a problem for some clubs, and I would think it would just destroy the rails. I recall there were still some castings floating around from that original build for sale, with a hefty price tag. Without the castings I cannot imagine building that engine. Not trying to discourage you, but the K 36/37s are insane.

The smaller K-27 might be an easier project. There are a few in 2.5” scale already, and castings were available at one point. Either way, Kozo Hiraoka’s series in Live Steam (in a smaller scale) would be a great reference for scaling up and building one from scratch without castings.

RMI’s engine’s are also pretty big engines minus the tremendous complexity, so they might be a good fit of the large scale is really what you’re after. There’s plenty of leeway to modify it and make it look like something you like, albeit there weren’t too many American prototypes of that design. Allen Models offers castings for the Sandy River 2’ 2-6-2 (largest in North America), which would be a great place to dive in since a few have been built and Steve Alley will be there to provide some support along the way.

Berkman
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Re: New member from Texas thinking about a K36 (or 37)

Post by Berkman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:49 pm

a 2.5 scale RGS 20 4-6-0 might be a good option. Big, but not too big etc...

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