Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

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RET
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by RET » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:54 pm

Hi,

As I said, there is always more.

I said that you can get a broken tap out using a diamond burr and a Dremel. With the small taps it helps a LOT if you use a binocular microscope. Working by feel is possible, but there simply is no substitute for being able to see what you are doing.

In that vein, you will find with a little patience, that you can also sharpen a dull tap; just use your binocular microscope with an abrasive cut off wheel running at high speed in a Dremel. Using a tap holder, run the wheel along the flutes of the tap (the ones that are advancing into the cut as the tap works). Be careful not to introduce a negative rake on the flute when you do this and also try to make sure that the sparks aren't directed into the microscope.

If you do it right, in the microscope you will see that the previously slightly rounded corners of the cutting edges are sharp again and when you use it, you will find that the tap cuts better. Its a little finiky to do and in many cases you will find that a new tap is cheap enough that it isn't really worth doing.

For bigger taps however (or odd ones eg. left hand), the process can be quite useful and will save you money. Personally, I find my binocular microscope to be very useful. As I said before, I've found that If I can see what I'm doing no matter what it is, I can do it!

The working upside down trick is well worth doing. I'll have to remember that one. When I do that one I'll combine it with what I describe in the next paragraph.

I haven't done it seriously yet, but one of these days I'm going to make 1/2" and 3/4" dia. knurled wheels with square holes filed in them, with the holes sized to match the square shanks of some of my really small taps. This is going to help a lot in turning the taps because I can just twirl them with the knurled wheels instead of having to fumble with a tap holder. That will give me much better control. I'll probably add a locking setscrew to the knurled wheel to hold it onto the tap.

In the previous post about balanced handwheels, all it means is that if a handwheel is balanced, any machine vibration won't cause the handwheel to turn so the heavy side is down. I could see this possibly happening if I was using carbide insert tooling at high speed to make a flat surface on a steel plate. That process is noisy and it also throws very hot chips literally everywhere (the speed is right when they come off blue, not brown). For that I would use the power feed and lock the y axis on the table.

As usual, I hope some of this helps.

Richard Trounce.

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Builder01
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by Builder01 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:38 pm

Yes, I suppose machine vibration could turn an "unbalanced" handwheel. I always lock all axis that are not being moved, that would include X and Y on a milling machine when just drilling a simple hole. The hand wheels (balanced or not) never move by themselves when used like this.

David

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NP317
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by NP317 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 10:49 pm

Greg_Lewis wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:25 pm
For the 00-90 and 0-80 taps, I use a pin vise to hold the tap. More sensitive feedback, and since you are turning the tap by the small diameter of the pin vise compared to the relatively large tap wrench, less chance of breakage.
My choice of tapping tool also, for very small threads.
However... I still use the float/hanging down method for reasons stated above.
~RN

shild
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by shild » Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:41 am

Builder01 wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:38 pm
Yes, I suppose machine vibration could turn an "unbalanced" handwheel. I always lock all axis that are not being moved, that would include X and Y on a milling machine when just drilling a simple hole. The hand wheels (balanced or not) never move by themselves when used like this.

David
So you got that loco finished enough to run it? Nice! By any small chance do you ever make your way out to Waushakum? On all the machines I've had so far the knob side of the handwheel would be the heavy side. So I would take the knob and bolt off, weigh them, cut a lead balancer almost twice as heavy and glue it on 180 degrees from the knob. That way the extra weight helps counterbalance your hand when you crank it. Makes for slightly smoother cuts too. If your machine isn't a valuable original antique that's too good to mutilate, I recommend you try it!

shild
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by shild » Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:57 am

RET wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:54 pm

I haven't done it seriously yet, but one of these days I'm going to make 1/2" and 3/4" dia. knurled wheels with square holes filed in them, with the holes sized to match the square shanks of some of my really small taps. This is going to help a lot in turning the taps because I can just twirl them with the knurled wheels instead of having to fumble with a tap holder. That will give me much better control. I'll probably add a locking setscrew to the knurled wheel to hold it onto the tap.

I need to do a repair similar to this. I want to make a knurled knob with a hole in the center with a flat spot along that hole to fit over a shaft with the same flat spot along it. The original knob was plastic and too weak so that's where it broke. So I want to make a metal knob now. I guess I should make the knob, knurl it and put a pilot hole through it, modify a round file by grinding a flat spot along it, then open the pilot hole up with the modified file?

shild
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by shild » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:03 am

Thanks for the replies and advice everyone! I'm going to stay away from making new 6-32 holes!

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Builder01
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by Builder01 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:40 am

Hi Shild,

Yes, I do plan to make it out to Washakum. Not this year, but, hopefully next year, 2019. My loco might be painted by then. Where you are located, as you have not revealed that in your profile for some reason.

Yes, my loco is running. Passed the boiler hydro test, hot and cold, in May of last year, 2017. Been running ever since, even though it was far from finished. I thought I mentioned earlier that is took me 9 month to get the chassis running on air and a total of 23 months to get my loco in steam. The title of this thread is "getting a project done faster".

Attached is a close up of the running gear. I do not have "balanced hand wheels" on any of my machines. This is not necessary to get a good finish. Proper tools speed, sharp tools, rigid set-up, proper feed and a little cutting oil is the key to good finish, not balanced hand wheels. All of the mill work you see in the photo was done by just "turning the wheels" by hand. Time is better spent making loco parts rather than bolting lead to hand wheels.
DSCN0889 - reduced.jpg
David

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SteveM
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by SteveM » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:38 am

I think that the main reason for counterweighted handles is that, if you let go of the handle, it won't move due to gravity and vibration.

I can't spin the handles on my machines fast enough for counterweights to matter.

Steve

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Builder01
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by Builder01 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:14 pm

If machine hand wheels are moving after you let go, you should tighten up the gibs. Also, lock that axsis of the machine after moving it. I have never had anything wander due to vibration if it has been properly locked. This is always a good idea anyway, as things can move without the hand wheel turning due to backlash in lead screws and loose gibs. Never rely on turning a hand wheel and then assuming nothing will move.

David

shild
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by shild » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:58 pm

Builder01 wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:14 pm
If machine hand wheels are moving after you let go, you should tighten up the gibs. Also, lock that axsis of the machine after moving it. I have never had anything wander due to vibration if it has been properly locked. This is always a good idea anyway, as things can move without the hand wheel turning due to backlash in lead screws and loose gibs. Never rely on turning a hand wheel and then assuming nothing will move.

David
For all on the mill, the lathe carriage, cross slide and compound I completely agree. But the tailstock with the spindle lock completely unlocked should be able to freewheel right? Mine does, it actually freewheels better moving toward the headstock than returning for some reason. I'm thinking about adding even more weight all around the wheel so I can just slap it to freewheel to clear chips while peck drilling.. By the way that's a nice pic! Did you use the stick method to do all those angle iron pieces at once? As for my profile, I'm new. I never fill out all that other stuff til later. I'm just happy if I can remember the name and password for now, but I've been visiting Waushakum on and off since the 70's.

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Builder01
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by Builder01 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:39 pm

Hi Shild,

I'm not sure if you are putting us on with "spinning the tail stock hand wheel". It is a bit dangerous "spinning" it in either direction. I'm sure you know why.

I filled out my profile from day one. It is of interest to know where the folks are, that you are "talking" to. It is also possible to reference meeting at a club track or model engineer expo. If I don't know where you are, this is of no use. No one wants your home address, just a general idea what part of the country (or which one) you are in, like North East U.S.

As for the angle iron, no, these were not machined by the "stick method". A piece of angle iron, in a sense, already is a "stick". These pieces were left and right handed, so the hole pattern was different on each one. Each was unique.

Waushakum looks like they have a very nice 4-3/4" track, that is what I am interested in and has been a recommended place to visit from many folks at the Finger Lakes Live Steamers. It is certainly on my short list of tracks to visit.

David

RET
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Re: Need some speed tips for getting a project done faster.

Post by RET » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:33 am

Hi,

A couple of comments and observations.

Kimball McGinley, thanks for your compliment!

Shild, having the "shelves" tipped makes it easier to see whats there as well as making it easier to remove and replace the items.

Finally, power feeds will always give a better finish than feeding by hand because the speed is consistent and smooth. That's why it is always a good idea to have all the normal attachments for a machine tool, like power feed on the mill.

Just my way of looking at the elephant.

Richard Trounce.

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