I'm just an operator

This forum is dedicated to the Live Steam Hobbyist Community.

Moderators: cbrew, Harold_V

theg8nw
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 4:34 am
Location: South Bend, IN
Contact:

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by theg8nw »

We call them "Biological Robots" People who run CNC equipment who have no idea what they are doing and have absolutely no reason to call themselves a machinist. I am part owner of a company that does CNC repair and laser calibration. Some of these "operators" do not even know how to perform simple tasks on the machine such as manually turning on the spindle(m3,m4) or doing a MDI tool change or even jog/handwheel movements.
Plan your work, work your plan.
www.measurementandmachine.com
User avatar
Harold_V
Posts: 20232
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by Harold_V »

NP317 wrote: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:34 pm Anthony said:
"If you know what you're doing, the biggest programming challenge is tricking the software into giving you the tool path you really want."
That made me laugh OUT LOUD! 'Totally describes my experience with CNC machining.
Even other methods. Many years ago I carried a contract from the Air Force to make over 600 spacers for the landing gear on the C-130. It was the reason I purchased the hydraulic duplicator for my Graziano.

The part was held to rather stringent tolerance on one diameter, considering its size. Made from 7075-T6 heavy wall tubing, and on a manual machine not well suited for flood coolant, I had to use a minimum of coolant to lubricate the cut and keep the part cool. It wasn't enough to cool the part completely, so I had to deal with expansion of the part as the cut progressed.

After turning out a couple of scrap pieces on the finish operation (the parts were fully roughed before finishing), I concluded that I had to introduce a few tenths taper to my template, which pulled the tool away from the part as the cut progressed. I was pleasantly surprised to end up with straight parts, well within tolerance.

I sold over 600 pounds of aluminum chips from that job.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
User avatar
Harold_V
Posts: 20232
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by Harold_V »

AnthonyDuarte wrote: Thu Mar 28, 2019 4:45 pm Harold,

Working with internal stress is definitely a huge part of it, and something that unfortunately doesn’t go away with CNC.

I did not use stress relieved material. Might have been nice, but I planned my operations to work with it. The first order of business was to rough out all sides,
It does my heart good to read your comment. I have harped endlessly on roughing and finishing, and have received virtually nothing in return in the way of comments. It's as if the concept isn't a requirement, and I am simply ignored. You can lead 'em to water, but------

There's nothing quite like working for a shop where everything is done to critical design, and all machining is subject to 100% inspection. That was the reality of my training, resulting in my gaining an understanding of the nature of things. You learned, or you endlessly made scrap. For some strange reason, management, there, frowned on that. :wink:

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
User avatar
Harold_V
Posts: 20232
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by Harold_V »

Greg_Lewis wrote: Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:17 pm I use DOC machining. Dumb Operator Control. I can mangle metal and ruin tooling on any machine that ever existed. Monty Python could make a great documentary in my shop. :shock:
Sounds a little like home. I think back to my glory days when I could crank out the work and rarely make a mistake. And it was tough (aero-space and defense) work.

I left the shop in '83, when I turned my full attention to refining precious metals. It has proven to be a mistake as far as keeping my skills in tune. I truly believe that if you don't use it, you lose it. Mine may not be gone, but let me tell you, there's one hell of a lot of rust on it now.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
User avatar
cbrew
Posts: 3161
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Vancouver Wa

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by cbrew »

Anthony,

First of all, beautiful work as usual,
what you say is very true and not just with the machining work.
this is also very true in the software world.
there is a big difference between a "Developer" (code monkey) , "Software Engineer" and "Technical Solution Architect".
1) "Developer" is someone that requires a detailed spec listing out desired results and predefined test cases.
2) "Software engineer" is someone that can take a manual spec from a non technical person and design, document and yield the end result.
3) "Technical Solution Architect" is someone that can evaluate the over all architecture(including every interconnecting system), understand how they interconnect. then design and deliver the solution.
I believe anyone can learn a "coding language", but it takes the right "mind" to be able to understand the over all goal and knowing how to end at the desired result.
anyone that is good at software, machining etc. all need to have one key trait. "Problem solving"
I guess that is why i prefer to kit bash over just simply following a stack of drawing.
keep up the beautiful work and as always, stay humble! I have a lot of respect for that!
If it is not live steam. its not worth it.
User avatar
NP317
Posts: 4557
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: Northern Oregon, USA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by NP317 »

Chris:
Your descriptions lead me to believe that anyone who builds a miniature working steam locomotive is a
Technical Solution Architect!
Keep smiling and building.
~RN
User avatar
cbrew
Posts: 3161
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Vancouver Wa

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by cbrew »

NP317 wrote: Fri Mar 29, 2019 11:05 am Chris:
Your descriptions lead me to believe that anyone who builds a miniature working steam locomotive is a
Technical Solution Architect!
Keep smiling and building.
~RN
haha,

well.
1) Developer = build to a stack of prints,
2) Software engineer = success kit basher
3) Technical Solution Architect = full on custom, developing prints and delivering a successful locomotive.

8) :? :shock: :D :) :wink: :roll:
ok back to run before i get into more trouble :)
If it is not live steam. its not worth it.
rkcarguy
Posts: 1730
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 10:33 am
Location: Wa State

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by rkcarguy »

Beautiful parts!
I've got about 10 years of machinist experience and always loved CNC, I mean, when you have a large radius on the inside or outside of a part, it's a huge task to mill it any other way. One of my favorite mills was the Bridgeport EZ-trak, anyone familiar with those? It was great for programming and running low quantities of some parts and left you manual control of the Z- axis which was great for drilling and power tapping bolt circles.

I never really had much problems with steel, but a lot of the stainless went crazy when milled and we had to make sure we milled an even amount off of each side of the part.
Marty_Knox
Posts: 1724
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2003 6:50 pm
Location: Michigan, USA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by Marty_Knox »

I'm not an operator or a machinist. But, I can make parts. I come from an operations background, running a steam tourist railroad.
The operative saying is 'Now is better than perfect!'
Repeat after me - 'It'll make a trip!'
User avatar
Greg_Lewis
Posts: 3014
Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2003 2:44 pm
Location: Fresno, CA

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by Greg_Lewis »

Marty_Knox wrote: Tue Apr 09, 2019 5:43 pm I'm not an operator or a machinist. But, I can make parts. I come from an operations background, running a steam tourist railroad.
The operative saying is 'Now is better than perfect!'
Repeat after me - 'It'll make a trip!'
Good one. A variant I've heard is: "An amateur makes it perfect. A professional makes it right and does it fast."
Greg Lewis, Prop.
Eyeball Engineering — Home of the dull toolbit.
Our motto: "That looks about right."
Celebrating 35 years of turning perfectly good metal into bits of useless scrap.
AMatthews
Posts: 90
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2009 8:46 am

Re: I'm just an operator

Post by AMatthews »

Hi Anthony
I think you sum up the whole thing just right. Each have their place and both places are just as important as one another. Your parts are magnificent you are to be congratulated on them. As a toolmaker & draftsman during my career having worked with both manual and CNC machinery I see it as two different skill sets with a lot of overlap both complimentary when used in the jobbing, small batch and or one person operation. the arguments people get into over these things are definitely facepalm material. Keep up the good work!

Cheers,
Andrew
Post Reply