British Steam

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DaveHughes
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jan 11, 2003 9:24 am
Location: Ontario, Canada

British Steam

Post by DaveHughes »

Hi folks:

This has probabley been asked before.
Why do British steam locomotives use inside cylinders on single expansion applications?
Dave
UnkaJesse
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Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:29 pm
Location: Tennessee, Obion County, Town of Troy

Re: British Steam

Post by UnkaJesse »

Dave, I think they only did that inside cylinder business at first. After they worked themselves through all the blue langauge uttered by poor machinists, they decided to put the running gear on the outside where it was accessable for easy repair. [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/crazy.gif"%20alt="[/img]

Unka(never did like the looks of those inside cylinder locos) Jesse
"The same hammer that breaks the glass, forges the steel" Russian proverb
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gwrdriver
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Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2003 10:31 am
Location: Nashville Tennessee

Re: British Steam

Post by gwrdriver »

There are several reasons, a principle one being to allow locomotives to pass within the relatively small (compared to the US) loading gauge. Most stations in the UK had platforms; typically passengers stepped directly onto the platform from the coaches, rather than down steps and then onto a stepstool as we do in the US. The height and proximity of the platforms wouldn't allow much in the way of cylinders to be hung off the outside of the frames. Anyway, anyone can hang a bunch of iron off brackets in plain view, it takes a consummate and patient craftsman, machinist, and fitter, model or full size, to create a full Stephenson gear on the inside. Builds character. Stiff upper lip, and all that, wot!
GWRdriver
Nashville TN
Tom_Wade
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:15 pm
Location: Hope, Indiana

Re: British Steam

Post by Tom_Wade »

Well, guys, you're both wrong. It's because the British use left hand steam, and we use right hand steam.
UnkaJesse
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Location: Tennessee, Obion County, Town of Troy

Re: British Steam

Post by UnkaJesse »

Tom, you have hit the nail on the head. LOL. [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/cool.gif"%20alt="[/img] Actually that business about the platforms that Brother Driver mentioned sort of sounds like the old "which came first, the chicken or the egg" adage. After all, you didn't need any platforms till the locos were running and some idjut mechanical engineer just happened to put the working parts on the inside so the platform builders took advantage of it and built right against the track. It was all downhill from there on with the poor maintainance machinists getting the "ignorant end of the stick" and sweating away in the inaccessable areas under the boiler, cussing the designers with all sorts of interesting references to their ancestory and telling them to stick things in physically impossible areas of their anatomy. [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/smirk.gif"%20alt="[/img]

Unka(I wants my lokemotive working parts on the outside) Jesse
"The same hammer that breaks the glass, forges the steel" Russian proverb
Marty_Knox
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Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2003 6:50 pm
Location: Michigan, USA

Re: British Steam

Post by Marty_Knox »

Actually, it's because British Mechanical Engineers have absolutely no concern for the men who have to maintain the locomotives they design!
Al_Messer
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Location: Mid Tenn.

Re: British Steam

Post by Al_Messer »

Right on!!
Al Messer

"One nation, under God"
Al_Messer
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Location: Mid Tenn.

Re: British Steam

Post by Al_Messer »

Drat! Last posting was supposed to reply to GW Drivers post. Personally, I LIKE British designs!! I could watch the little engine in "The Quiet Man" all day long!!
Al Messer

"One nation, under God"
UnkaJesse
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Location: Tennessee, Obion County, Town of Troy

Re: British Steam

Post by UnkaJesse »

Al, I don't give a diddly how "cute" those Brit locos are, Marty Knox and I have the right idea, the mechanical engineers never had to work on their creations, if they had done so, (as with modern automobiles) drastic redesign work would have been first on the agenda.! [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/crazy.gif"%20alt="[/img]

Unka(I still like my running stuff hanging out where I can get to it)Jesse
"The same hammer that breaks the glass, forges the steel" Russian proverb
RoundHouse Rat

Re: British Steam

Post by RoundHouse Rat »

I first saw your point about mechanical engineers in a book written by a roundhouse supervisor from England. His suggestion was that ALL mechanical engineers should be assigned to work in a roundhouse for at least 6 months before they were allowed to make any modification on any piece of equipment. Could also be said about locomotive engineers. (Especially those that are prone to flatspot wheels.)
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Dick_Morris
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Location: Anchorage, AK

Re: British Steam

Post by Dick_Morris »

While working on my MBA, I ran across a text that described it as "over the wall engineering." The concept is that the engineers throw their designs over the barrier that exists between design and production and expect the production people to be able to manufacture them.
Al_Messer
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Re: British Steam

Post by Al_Messer »

One aspect that we have not considered is perhaps the British locomotives were so well built that they did not have to have a lot of "tuning" done on them until it was time for a major overhaul. Then, they could just lift off the boiler and everything would be right there within easy reach.
Al Messer

"One nation, under God"
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