After looking through J-E's beautiful www site in Finland, I see that his friend is constructing a 1-1/2" engine with a working stoker.
I have never actually seen a functioning stoker in live steam, and mentioned this to Jim. His immediate response was...
"I saw one, 1942, in Danver's Mass. A fellow from North Carolina had one in 3/4" on an 0-4-0. I don't remember what the engine was modelled after, but it was painted green. I am not SURE of the man's name, but I think it was Yoder. I do know that he was with Otha Hedge, also from North Carolina. Somewhere I have a picture of the engine..at least I used to...it may not have survived the fire (Jim's house burned down last year)...I will have to look around a bit...
The stoker ran and actually worked. The only problem was that the stoker and distribution unit used up all the available steam and he could either run the loco or run the stoker, but not both.."
All this from an 83 year old...that saw something 63 years ago..
OK, so has anyone else ever seen a functioning stoker? And is there any chance that anyone out there has any idea where this specific engine may have gone?
Working Stoker
-
UnkaJesse
- Posts: 4090
- Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:29 pm
- Location: Tennessee, Obion County, Town of Troy
Bill, one would think that the coal would have to be so small to work in that scale that it would be burned as fast as it was blown in and that a lot of it would wind up in the smoke box. 
Unka(Hummmm, ought to keep the flues blasted out clean though
)Jesse
Unka(Hummmm, ought to keep the flues blasted out clean though
)Jesse"The same hammer that breaks the glass, forges the steel" Russian proverb
-
Bill Shields
getting stoked
UKJ:
That is exactly what I would have thought, and I was blown away by the fact that Jim had SEEN one in 3/4" that functioned properly...1-1/2" maybe, but 3/4"...??????...
I will bet he had an arch in there somewhere...
Yes, Jim said there appeared to have been a LOT of 'preparation time' on the coal to get it to work....ALL the coal was very specific in size...
Up the stack is / was a moot point since there wasn't enough steam to do both...so MAYBE that is / was / could have been a problem unseen / not admitted to at the time by the builder...heck if I could even build one, let alone make it work, I would show it off like crazy..
Will be interested in how J-E's friend makes out....if 3/4" CAN work, then 1-1/2 has a better chance of having enough steam available to keep it going.
That is exactly what I would have thought, and I was blown away by the fact that Jim had SEEN one in 3/4" that functioned properly...1-1/2" maybe, but 3/4"...??????...
I will bet he had an arch in there somewhere...
Yes, Jim said there appeared to have been a LOT of 'preparation time' on the coal to get it to work....ALL the coal was very specific in size...
Up the stack is / was a moot point since there wasn't enough steam to do both...so MAYBE that is / was / could have been a problem unseen / not admitted to at the time by the builder...heck if I could even build one, let alone make it work, I would show it off like crazy..
Will be interested in how J-E's friend makes out....if 3/4" CAN work, then 1-1/2 has a better chance of having enough steam available to keep it going.
-
Bill Shields
Terpsichoric Pachyderm
Ok, so when the elephant comes down hard...who cleans up after it?
Actually I think it is great that a couple of people have proven that it is a workable project....and would REALLY make a neat LS article....something that I am SURE has not been seen before.
Were it not that I am practically marrried to propane, I would be tempted....again, like you say, just to prove that it will work and say 'been there done that'....
Actually I think it is great that a couple of people have proven that it is a workable project....and would REALLY make a neat LS article....something that I am SURE has not been seen before.
Were it not that I am practically marrried to propane, I would be tempted....again, like you say, just to prove that it will work and say 'been there done that'....
-
Guest
A number of years ago "Model Railroader" ran an article (series?) on building an operating coal mine (I think it was). The output of the mine was augered from point A to point B using a carpenter's auger in an appropriately sized piece of plastic pipe. The principle would work for moving coal from a tender to a firebox as well, but a whole lot of designing would be needed first. Charles
-
Rob Gardner
- Posts: 463
- Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:27 am
- Location: Newbury, OH
Miniature Stokers
I just had the pleasure of meeting a retired Chessie/C&O engineer/machinist this week who is building a very accurate 1.5" scale model of a C&O K3 Mikado, including of all things, a stoker. I chose not to question its functionality as this gentleman has gone to great lengths over a 26 year period of time to faithfully reproduce this incredible locomotive and he hasn't even complete the tender yet!
Nonetheless, he says he has the firing table and coal distribution jets well along. The light wasn't sufficient for me to see under the cab that well but judging by all of the various systems he reproduced already (functioning low water alarm, scratchbuilt injectors, injector starter valve, two two-cylinder air compressors, etc.) I wouldn't doubt that he will have a stoker system that will work. The size of the coal, of course, will be another matter.
Ralph MacAllister, late of Boulder, Colorado, built a 3" scale (14-1/8" gauge) 2-8-8-4, based mainly on the Rio Grande's L-131 class 2-8-8-2. When I last saw it on display at the antique car museum at the Royal Gorge, I noticed a miniature stoker laying in the front of the tender. It had never been installed, but Ralph was obviously anticipating this feature. I believe the housing for the auger was in the 3" to 4" diameter range.
While neither of these cases have been tested or proven, it has been thought of by these two gentlemen.
Rob Gardner
Nonetheless, he says he has the firing table and coal distribution jets well along. The light wasn't sufficient for me to see under the cab that well but judging by all of the various systems he reproduced already (functioning low water alarm, scratchbuilt injectors, injector starter valve, two two-cylinder air compressors, etc.) I wouldn't doubt that he will have a stoker system that will work. The size of the coal, of course, will be another matter.
Ralph MacAllister, late of Boulder, Colorado, built a 3" scale (14-1/8" gauge) 2-8-8-4, based mainly on the Rio Grande's L-131 class 2-8-8-2. When I last saw it on display at the antique car museum at the Royal Gorge, I noticed a miniature stoker laying in the front of the tender. It had never been installed, but Ralph was obviously anticipating this feature. I believe the housing for the auger was in the 3" to 4" diameter range.
While neither of these cases have been tested or proven, it has been thought of by these two gentlemen.
Rob Gardner
-
Andypullen
- Posts: 2166
- Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:17 am
- Location: Bel Air, MD
working stoker
Hi Bill,
In response to Mr. Propane (Bill Cody) there is a locomotive on the west coast with a working stoker. It was written up in an issue of Live Steam from 1986. He is correct; the builder is/was a member of Riverside Live Steamers. I don't know if he's still with us....
I'm working on one for a future project, but am having trouble finding the auger for the screw. I may have to make it....
Andy Pullen
In response to Mr. Propane (Bill Cody) there is a locomotive on the west coast with a working stoker. It was written up in an issue of Live Steam from 1986. He is correct; the builder is/was a member of Riverside Live Steamers. I don't know if he's still with us....
I'm working on one for a future project, but am having trouble finding the auger for the screw. I may have to make it....
Andy Pullen
Clausing 10x24, Sheldon 12" shaper, ProtoTrak AGE-2 control cnc on a BP clone, Reed Prentice 14" x 30", Sanford MG 610 surface grinder, Kalamazoo 610 bandsaw, Hardinge HSL speed lathe, Hardinge HC chucker, Kearney and Trecker #2K plain horizontal mill, Haas TL-1 lathe.
Andy, chase down an electrical distribution crew or a high tension line construction crew, working on poles. A couple dozen doughnuts or, if on a warm Friday afternoon, a dozen cold beverages could acquire you a slow helix, 1"+ x18" drill bit. The high tension gang will have larger diameter bits.
Regards,
Greg B.
Regards,
Greg B.
-
Bill Shields
stoker augers
Andy:
Actually, making the auger is NOT all that difficult....time consuming but not difficult.
If you want to make it like they used to, lay out an Archimedes spiral using the ID of the containment tube and OD of the center pipe as your parameters and PULL IT, then silver solder or braze the works together. When I worked at duPont, we made MANY full-size augers that way, and it really works...a PITB....but that is how they are made industrally.
For a second there, when I first read your reply, I though that ou were saying Bill Cody had a propane fired loco with a stoker....which would only work with REALLY COLD propane...and would have to run REALLY FAST to get the stuff into the firebox before it thawed....guess I need some breakfast...
Actually, making the auger is NOT all that difficult....time consuming but not difficult.
If you want to make it like they used to, lay out an Archimedes spiral using the ID of the containment tube and OD of the center pipe as your parameters and PULL IT, then silver solder or braze the works together. When I worked at duPont, we made MANY full-size augers that way, and it really works...a PITB....but that is how they are made industrally.
For a second there, when I first read your reply, I though that ou were saying Bill Cody had a propane fired loco with a stoker....which would only work with REALLY COLD propane...and would have to run REALLY FAST to get the stuff into the firebox before it thawed....guess I need some breakfast...