Spark Arrestor

pwcphoto · Post by **pwcphoto** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:34 am

I have heard that Train Mountain now requires all coal and diesel fired locomotives to have a spark arrestor on the stack to prevent fires. Does anyone have a design of a good Train Mountain approved spark arrestor?

I will be putting it on an RMI Prairie which is oil fired so it will be fairly large I would guess.

Thanks,

Phil

Harlock · Post by **Harlock** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 3:52 am

All I know is that one of those mesh pencil holders upside down does NOT work.

All it does is melt the coating of the holder all over your smokebox.

The upshot is that it made the smokebox very realistically dirty for a photo shoot later...

It was what my friends could think of when they found out literally a few days before driving up to TM.

Now, is that restriction all year around or just fire season?

At the triennial this year, it was an exceptionally dry time and only propane fired steamers were allowed out in the north 40 on the other side of the road, regardless of arrestors. I am wondering if that policy changes depending on the time of year.

--Mike

JJG Koopmans · Post by **JJG Koopmans** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:24 am

Maybe it is time to point again to Prof. W.F.M. Goss' book of 1902 "Locomotive Sparks". Sparks below a certain size do not start fires according to his research. In the book all kinds of spark prevention mechanisms are shown and tested.
The book is online:
http://www.archive.org/details/locomoti ... 00gossrich
Downloadable pdf button in the leftside window.
Regards
Jos Koopmans

Dave_Johnson · Post by **Dave_Johnson** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:12 pm

Unfortunately, model Live steam locos do throw sparks and start fires. Sparks and cinders do not scale down.

Dave J.

Marty_Knox · Post by **Marty_Knox** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:41 pm

My experience has been that you can start more fires from a poor fitting ashpan, or an ashpan with holes in it.

tburzio · Post by **tburzio** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:14 pm

Harlock wrote: Now, is that restriction all year around or just fire season?

Spark arrestors are required at TM always, as at many tracks. Solid fuel engines are banned from forest lands (the other side of North Chiloquin Road) by the National Park Service during certain dry times of the year, not the Friends of Train Mountain. Train Mountain itself is normally always open for solid fuel.

I made it to M&M at the end of track before the ban on solid fuel (Monday & Tuesday of the Triennial).

The size of the grid will depend on the type of fuel. There are no standards for what the arrestor should be. Logically, each engine owner should take their engine out at night and put it under heavy load and see if the arrestor is working.

AusDan · Post by **AusDan** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:29 pm

My 5" o4o engine (5" barrel) puts out a few sparks, along the way...At our local club is not too much of issue as there isnt vast open areas of cinder material around. (though ppl hate getting holes in there clothes from sitting on your train)

But once visting a club interstate my little engine caused a grass fire, with in a minute or two there was 20m x 20 m pactch, luckly enough I was able to just stamp out the fire front, as it was low cut dead grass.

ashpan wise, yes I have seen many, but in most case its contained inside the rail and and dosnt spread far.

I will be overhauling this issue when I get her back into steam again

LivingLegend · Post by **LivingLegend** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:58 pm

You guys wanna talk about sparks?

You should have seen David Rorher's 2.5" SR&RRL no.5 back in the "good ol' days" when it still burned hard wood for it's fuel. It put on a real good light show at night runs. Many a passenger riding behind the loco got cinder holes in their shirts!

David later converted, to the disapointment of many, myself included, to oil for fuel.

I can tell everyone, from personal experiance, that David's no. 5 was a FUN engine to run.... Throwing that wood in the firebox!

LL

bobb · Post by **bobb** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:18 pm

Maricopa Live Steamers have a standard for spark arrestors.
I believe it is a maximum of 3/16 opening. See their website to be sure.

tburzio · Post by **tburzio** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:09 am

At the Triennial lots of people bought bags of "char", a type of Australian coke I think. Anyways, one of the drawbacks was that the embers from the char were going right through even the smallest mesh on spark arrestors. I know that I had a lot of slaps on my skin from the burning embers, whereas coal embers would just bounce around in the screen cage like watching a popcorn popper.

Standards are very difficult when the answer is "it depends".

steam4ian · Post by **steam4ian** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:27 am

G'day

We burn Char at our club and don't have spark problems. One one 7.25"G loco has a spark arrester, a tea strainer held above the top of the stack, but that loco is a Shay with a very fierce blast.

We crush the char lumps and put it through a trummel with three mesh sizes. The under 3/8" goes to the steam house to add to the boiler fuel. We have three crushed sizes 3/8" to 5/8", 5/8" to 3/4" and 3/4" to 11/4" That we get so little fines is a tribute to the crusher which is a jaw type.

My loco has a small and narrow grate so I burn the small stuff. I have only seen about 2 sparks when in the dark of the tunnel and I have to open the throttle to lift the train out. They were small and extiguished before dropping down. I get lots of ash in the smokebox and ash up the stack but no/little sparks. I think my findings are tha same as others at the club.

Char is briquetted brown coal partially pyrolysed. A similar product is sold as barbeque charcoal. It yields a gritty brown ash with little clinker. Because there is little gas the lumps hold together and don't "explode" when burning.

I think the answer may well be the screening.

Regards
Ian

Fred_V · Post by **Fred_V** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 8:38 am

here is a design that i like. this is on a 5" ga.

The Home Machinist!

Spark Arrestor

Spark Arrestor

Spark Arrestors

Re: Spark Arrestors