Eureka Project

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WJH
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby WJH » Thu Aug 23, 2012 5:15 pm

Only going to make three? No drawings or parts? Trying to influence price by making it a limited run?
Are you trying to create the Beanie Baby of the live steam world?
You know, value will only go up if there is a demand, otherwise your going to lose out on a larger market.

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LivingLegend
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby LivingLegend » Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:49 pm

Harold_V wrote:
jessebanning wrote:I got the piston rods done and the valves done.

Milling with a drill chuck? (Third picture down).
Not really recommended.
Comments?

Harold


Drill chucks are fine for downward thrust, not side thrust. And there is not enough jaw area to grip on the end mill's shank area. If the cutter spins in the chuck while feeding.... there goes the cutter.

Save the drill chucks for drills and reamers.

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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Harold_V » Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:51 pm

LivingLegend wrote:Drill chucks are fine for downward thrust, not side thrust. And there is not enough jaw area to grip on the end mill's shank area. If the cutter spins in the chuck while feeding.... there goes the cutter.

Save the drill chucks for drills and reamers.

LL

Another of the negative aspects with drill chucks is they're not intended to grip hardened objects. Shanks of drills and reamers are typically not heat treated, so the jaws create miniscule indents which increase driving power. That's unlike end mill shanks, which are fully hardened. Makes it easy for the tool to slip in the jaws, to say nothing of the typical eccentricity that is so common of drill chucks. Overall, not a wise setup, but one does what one has to do to get the job done.

I'm certainly not being critical of the setup, as I don't know what issues Jesse faced, but it's a good idea to make mention for folks who are in the learning phase of machining and may not have a firm understanding. The use of end mills in drill chucks is not recommended (yes, I've done it, too, but not for side milling).

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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Harlock » Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:29 pm

Harold_V wrote:Another of the negative aspects with drill chucks is they're not intended to grip hardened objects. Shanks of drills and reamers are typically not heat treated, so the jaws create miniscule indents which increase driving power. That's unlike end mill shanks, which are fully hardened. Makes it easy for the tool to slip in the jaws, to say nothing of the typical eccentricity that is so common of drill chucks. Overall, not a wise setup, but one does what one has to do to get the job done.

Harold


That explains why when drill bits occasionally get stuck in parts (when breaking through the other side of a hole for example) they spin in the chuck and the chuck tears up the drill shank requiring me to clean up the shank afterwards, because the chuck has torn it up while spinning around.

Any opinion on using drill bits in collets when they are common size bits that fit in fractional collets? I've done it once or twice without issue, but if the collet holds on to it extra well, the bit itself could break off in the part rather than spinning in the jaws of a chuck...


-M
Last edited by Harlock on Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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LivingLegend
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby LivingLegend » Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:32 pm

I left out one thing....

There is also the matter of excessive run-out in a drill chuck..... Particularly with worn jaws.

LL
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LivingLegend
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby LivingLegend » Thu Aug 23, 2012 11:40 pm

Mike....

It's not unusual for drill bits (and reamers) of any size, fraction, letter, number, or decimal with a straight shank are held in collets. In CNC mills or lathes, or in manual machines..... like a turret lathe.

LL
Last edited by LivingLegend on Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Harold_V » Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:17 am

Yep--what LL said. It's not only acceptable, but preferred, as you can expect far better performance. The real negative is the relatively slow changes of tools. I have often overcome that by using a quick change in my spindle, holding the various cutting tools in the small #30 taper adapters. Much faster and precise, and depths can be set with reliability.

Harold
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Harold_V » Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:24 am

Harlock wrote:That explains why when drill bits occasionally get stuck in parts (when breaking through the other side of a hole for example) they spin in the chuck and the chuck tears up the drill shank requiring me to clean up the shank afterwards, because the chuck has torn it up while spinning around.

Exactly.

If you are making reference to the use of Silver & Deming drills, you can benefit greatly by milling three flats @ 120° intervals on the shank. They will prevent the drill from spinning. They need not be very deep, just a few thou, enough to cover the width of the jaws of the chuck.

If you choose to create the flats, ensure that you hold the drill by the portion just beyond the flutes, where you have a relatively round surface. The flats should be generated with the use of an indexing head, to ensure that you maintain the 120° spacing, and the depth of cut is uniform around the shank, so the drill runs on center, and doesn't whip.

Take note that the flats can be beneficial in jobber length drills, too, at least in the larger sizes (3/8" >)

Harold
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Harlock
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Harlock » Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:47 am

The flats are a great idea. If I have a drill size where I'm doing a lot of holes and it's a recurring problem, then that's a good route to take. Don't have an indexing head currently though, but I can borrow one for the job.
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby jessebanning » Fri Aug 24, 2012 8:38 am

Good morning. I know using a chuck is not preferred. My other mills were tied up so I was using the Tree mil. It does not take and R8 collet like the Bridgeports. The cutter was .168" and the shank was .168" and carbide. Kinda an odd ball size. I only took .030" passes at high RPM. No problems. If one of the other machines were free, I would have used it and used a collet. :lol:
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby jessebanning » Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:00 am

So this is not recommended? lol
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Dwight Ennis
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Re: Eureka Project

Postby Dwight Ennis » Fri Aug 24, 2012 9:06 am

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