LE New Northern

[Paul Quick]

The LE New Northern is based on the Atlantic/Pacific design and plans. I have the drawing and they are from that set of drawings. New drawings for the frame and Trailing truck and cradle are included. The Cylinders are from the common 4-4-2/ 4-6-2 L E engines. They are Piston valve as are all L E engine as of about the mid 90's. I have one under construction and have been trying to get a set of cylinder castings for three months now. The casting is three pieces, Center Saddle and Left and Right cylinders. The wheels are 10" spoke or the boxpox type can be used. The boiler is 10" sked. 40 pipe but longer approx. 65".

[765nkp]

Steamingdanny,

Just so you know "locoworks" is Clarke Simms of Little Engines

[Miserlou57]

I remember a few months ago DiscoverLiveSteam.com had an open letter to the Live Steam community saying Little Engines was for sale. Anybody have any updates on that?

[locoboilerguy]

I ran across this looking for some and while I normally don't get into this stuff I thought some clarification might be proper.

John Elletts (sp) engine was built in 1979-1981 or thereabouts. John lived about 1/4 mile from me in Westchester. I machined the frames, cut down the cradle and two axle trailing truck and welded them back together to shorten the trailing truck to more NYC dimensions. It did not exactly pre-date the Hudson/New Northern in that it was a concurrent project. There were a number of other parts I made for the engine but time has deleted them from the memory bank. Also built the boiler and smokebox. The original Pacific/Atlantic were 9" boilers but a number have been built with 10" pipe boilers (10 3/4" od). The Hudson/New Northern is also 10" pipe with a 11 1/2" smokebox to match the old northern door and ring but we had turned some down to 10 3/4" for a pipe smokebox.

An interesting side story right now is I recall when John called me to tell me he had the chassis running on air. He also had let his finger rest between the frame and driver spoke and when it rolled over it simply lopped off the very end. He was only part way through timing it and it was one of those deals where enough pressure built up to move the drivers a half turn. So we all need to watch our various parts when working on these.

Anyway after this engine I gave Moodie enough dimensions to produce the New Northern and Hudson from a combination of the old northern parts and pacific parts. The ones we have weighted were about 1100# for Mike Russo's Hudson so the northern is probably about 150# heavier. Many moons ago Chet Petersons old northern was weighted at LALS and at the time it was 999#. Now keep in mind the original boiler design is only 1/4" material and fairly light compared to the new versions which is probably 1/3 heavier for the boiler and smokebox. New ones have been built using both styles of drivers.

The old Atlantic/Pacific design was slide valves and a great many of them ran very well for years. Moodie converted them to piston valves in about 1981. They were left outside admission due to the slide valve design for the valve gear and Moodie did not want to alter that. The slide valve pattern that has been floating around I have. Its not good for much these days and was always loose.

Winton only built one of his engines as a slide valve which was Bob Franks 2-6-0. I still have the valve pattern and drawings. All the rest are piston valve even though the chests are slides in appearance.

As far as the piston valve Little Engines Pacific group I honestly would rather have the slide valve engine as they sound a little better and are easier to time very accurately. That being said they both run well if properly put together.

[LSGOD]

When my friend Ward started his ATSF 2900 he bought the frames and axle boxes from LE. We found out that the frames had been water jet cut out and had so much taper that when they were machined the premachined axle boxs would have have been .040 too small. LE said that would be alright since it would prevent driver binding? I suggested that he start over with new frames and axle boxes which he did. Also used the 80" (10.625" 1.593 scale) drivers that I have patterns for. These drivers are also on the 2 Haas 2900's, 3-GS4's and a UP 800 somewhere. These drivers are available also the 73 1/2 spoked drivers for the GS1.

LSGOD

[Miserlou57]

I'd be fairly interested in building a GS-1 out of a New Northern, but considering they have different size drivers, how does one accommodate that change?

I would think with a smaller wheel leaving all the running gear intact would be the easiest thing to do, while adjusting the front and rear truck heights. I wouldn't want to embark on such a modification unless it's fairly straightforward. The rest of the engine looks like it would need little modification.

[Dan_M]

A bit late in chiming in here. I built a GS-4 from LE New Northern prints. Well, I should say I used some of the prints. I did the frame per the plans and bought the rear/front trucks from LE. I modified the front trucks to be 11” between centers (the LE plans call for 9”). I left the rear truck alone but is not an exact match for the GS-4. The engine castings where not LE’s as I needed one with a 3” bore and a 4” stroke. All the rods and valve gear were custom made along with the cab and almost everything else (boiler, smokebox door, pilot, skyline casing, skirting, tender, etc.). If I had it to do over again, I would not have used a “built up” frame per the LE plans. Water or laser cut would have been my preference. But heck, I didn’t know much back then and everything still turned out fine.
Dan
http://www.danslocoworks.com

[makinsmoke]

Being just a tad modest now aren't we Dan?

If anyone has not been to his website or not seen his engine in the flesh (I'm part of that sad fraternity) you really are missing out.

Dan did a fantastic job of not only building but documenting his build.

As with several of our other builders that take the time to do so, much can be learned from perusing his website.

A one of a kind, beautiful engine.

Brian

[LocoJerome]

I couldn't agree more Brian! As a newbie looking to build his first locomotive, Dan's website has been very inspiring to say the least. I really appreciate the time some folks have taken to build a website and share the build process with others like me. You glean so much information from the photos and of course come up with as many questions. Thanks Dan!

Jerome

[Dan_M]

Brian/Jerome - Thank you very much for the kind words.

On another note, many people have been asking me for the passenger car blueprints. These cars are 10' long and 16" wide and weigh about 350lbs (all steel) with the trucks. I didn't plan on giving the blueprints out because they are a mess. They worked for me but would be tough for others to understand them in the state they are in. I am cleaning them up and putting together a materials list. Hope to have everything done in a few months so I can publish them. I doubt very much I will do the same for the engine/tender as they are very complex (and more of a mess) and not something I want to show the general public how bad my CAD drawing skills are.

I did finish the observation car, just haven't updated the web site yet.

Dan

[Steamingdanny]

Can't wait to read your observation car!

[Miserlou57]

I would be pretty interested in building a new northern if changing the boiler diameter is relatively feasible. I particularly like 1.6" scale locomotives because they really sit larger on the rails... particularly the Haas 2900-class northern. I would really like to build a SP GS-1 or something like it.... would making a larger boiler fit be particularly difficult?