Coal & Firing

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Highiron
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Highiron »

Back in 1998 I bought some bagged Welsh from the west coast from a fellow who said he was the only person allowed to import it to the US, when I inquired about a bulk discount for buying 4 tonnes he declined and the price was ridiculous, so I contacted a friend and client over in the UK and arranged for him to make a purchase of coal after we gathered slot of information about the different grades available, so it was bought and I brought over 4 tonnes of Bean and small nut welsh to try, we were dealing with David Sutton of Signal Fuels, I do alot of business with the UK and alot with a big steam ship line so it was easy for me...this was VERY high quality coal and better than what I had gotten from California importer, it sold well and I then ordered 20 tonnes of it in both sizes and had the Steamship line bring it over for me, if I did not have my shipping contacts and import brokers and freight forwarder friends it would have been way to expensive, , this batch had good bags and fair bags of quality (time frame about 2001), when I called over to David and questioned the coal, he had said that they had hit a fault in the vane it it would be a year or so untill they got through it, the coal was still good but had the ocasoinal clinker but nothing to give you greif if you dealt with it fast, I sold the coal for $25.00 for a 44 pound bag either Bean or small nut when I ran out of it I was going to bring more over but declined as I did not want to get involed and store it for another 4 years because the bags are not UV stable and they split on fall apart in the sun, I was also told the the quality was good but the high grade fuel of the past was gone and the stuff today has a much lower volitales percentage and a bit more ash content

so at that point I went back to soft US coal for running my engines on and I am not sorry, even though it is smokey one thing it did cut down on was carry over up the stack, the welsh is light and flakes as it burns and we got alot and I mean alot of sparks and fire works out the stack when working even midly hard, while I do get some with Pokey or Ebt and some of the others I use it is nothing like what the welsh produced...the welsh , if you can get the good stuff is great for smaller engines but I will stick to the Bituminus for my big stuff
Pontiacguy1
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Pontiacguy1 »

I've burned some 'free' coal out of an Alabama mine in the past. VERY smokey and would soot up your tubes in about 3 hours or so of running. I've had people ask me before, jokingly of course, if I was mixing shredded up used tires in with my coal. It burned pretty hot, but it would really clinker up and of course was really smokey and had lots of yellow sulfur.

I decided that I didn't want to have to stop during the day and brush the flues, so I then went and bought a bunch of the pocohontas #3 that you've heard about. I got about 30 bags for members of the club, but got almost 4,000 lbs of it loose in the back of my dad's dually, which I'd taken the fuel tanks and tool boxes out of. I still have a decent supply, enough to last me another 4 or 5 years.

The place where I bought it was City Coal Company in Brazil, Indiana. From what I've heard, their supplier quit supplying coal to them and they've since closed down. It was about 6 years ago when I went to get that coal, and at that time it was $180/ton loose, or you could buy it pre-bagged for $10/50lb bag. I've heard that the company that owns the mines no longer sells any in the US, but all of the mine's output is shipped over to China.

I don't know what I'm going to do when I run out of what I have. The EPA has about put all of US coal users and some of the producers out of business, and we depended on the big boys to let us have a little bit of their output for our purposes. If I can get any more of that Pocohontas #3 coal in the future, i would probably get about 6000 to 8000 lbs next time.
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Harlock
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Harlock »

General related question: Does anyone know if coal degrades or changes composition over time with exposure to air? Someone mentioned that it might be the case.

I have some soft coal that has been sitting in buckets for maybe 10 years. I did use some a while back and did not have any trouble, though the color seems to have bleached a little on the outside surfaces.

-M
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Steam Engine Dan
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Steam Engine Dan »

Harlock wrote:General related question: Does anyone know if coal degrades or changes composition over time with exposure to air? Someone mentioned that it might be the case.

I have some soft coal that has been sitting in buckets for maybe 10 years. I did use some a while back and did not have any trouble, though the color seems to have bleached a little on the outside surfaces.

-M
I have burned coal that has sat in my garage for over 20 years, and it still burns good. I have about 12 bags, and 4 open buckets full.

if you are not sure about it, you can always send it to me. i'll burn any kind of junk coal that people don't want
Last edited by Steam Engine Dan on Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
tomc
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by tomc »

I heard water is bad for coal as it degrades it. Ours gets wet from snow & rain and it seems to work so wonder if it is a myth?

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Fender
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Fender »

I expect that the main effect on coal with exposure to weather would be to break it up into smaller pieces. A friend has been using spilled coal from a coaling tower on the RR, which would be at least 60 years old.
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Bob D.
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Bob D. »

I dunno, it's been in the ground for a few million years. Most coal mines have massive pumps keeping the water out. It's washed several times in processing to size to remove dust. I burned a lot of it for heat in my shop that came from a coal bunker in my basement that was built in 1867. I think it's pretty hard to damage coal........

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steamin10
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by steamin10 »

rumor has it that water and rain exposure can remove some volitiles, and most notably sulfur from the surfaces of the coal. But overall, not a big deal. Organics and dirt are a larger problem in salvaged coal from any source. Screening may be needed to remove such junk.
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PeterCraymer
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by PeterCraymer »

I am with PontiacGuy with the Alabama coal. I bought 50lb bags at Buck Coal and Ice in Columbus Ga. and he told me that it cam from North Alabama. Same properties - smoky, a lot of ash, a fair amount of clinkers (must keep them broken up with what seems like excessive raking of the fire) and tubes darn near plugged up on the firebox end and ash pan completely full after 3-4 hours worth of running. Video coal is what I call it. It's the stuff you need so that people know what you are burning when they video the engine in operation! I have been told there is a place right off of I-81 in Va. to get Pocohontas, so next time we travel north, I am going to see about finding them. It would be nice to find something already in a burnable size. Some of the lumps I get now are bigger than my fist and need to be broken down. That just takes more time. it was only $12 a bag, so I guess you get what you pay for.

Peter
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shayloco
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by shayloco »

I've heard that the company that owns the mines no longer sells any in the US, but all of the mine's output is shipped over to China.
I was told the same story by Kimmel Coal in Pennsylvania last fall. I had hoped to stop and buy a bunch of Pocohontas coal from them on a trip through the state. Sure wish there was another source of Pocohontas coal.

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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by Soot n' Cinders »

The Penn Keystone coal company sells Pocahontas #3: http://www.penncoal.com/wst_page5.html
They sell it $15 for a 50 pound bag or by the truckload: 22-26 tons. There's a farrier supply north of me in Jasper, GA that sells blacksmith coal by the bag or stoker coal by the pound, but I'm not sure where it's from, I'll ask next time I'm up there. All I know about it is that it burns well without much clinker or ash and everyone at the railroad uses it (partly because it's the closest supply of coal).
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rspringer
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Re: Coal & Firing

Post by rspringer »

I bought soft blacksmith coal in Verona VA last year. It was in 50 lb bags. I have not used it yet still working on steamer. Dixie Gas & Oil just checked on price 50 lb of Soft (Bituminous) coal: Pea/Stoker size is 11.50 and Hard (Anthracite) coal: Nut size 40 lb is 7.00 a bag. The soft coal was labeled as blacksmith. Don't know where it came from.
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