Vortex canister design

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millman5
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Vortex canister design

Post by millman5 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:50 am

Does anyone have design plans for a vortex canister?

A shop vac just doesn't cut it for sweeping dusty floors. I get nowhere before the filter is so clogged it will no longer pick up. After a very few cleanings the filter usually developes holes or tears. After that about all you accomplish id re-arranging the fine dust to settle places you don't want it.

It occurs to me that some sort of vortex pre cleaner would (should) help tremendously to increase shop vac filter life.

Anyone have any ideas?
If it works Don't fix it....

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steamin10
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Post by steamin10 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:17 am

We ran into that same problem of 'clean' air.

My very large shop vac was used on construction for some time. The same problem, sucking up drywall dust clogged filters to distraction. One genious on the crew bought 50 feet of sump pump hose, and plumbed it to the exhaust and ran it outside. Simple window screen for a filter. Worked well until we had to all wash our trucks one day, dusted with powder. We sponged our work later, and avoid sanding if we can.

I have a half built separator for my shop, with the purpose of using the sawdust and planer chips for animal bedding. A 55 gallon drum is fitted with a 5 gallon pail hanging upside down. The vacuum source draws air through the top center of the lid and bucket. The shop lead is fed into the side of the drum at a tangent alongside the bucket. As the stream enters the larger space, between the bucket and drum, it swirls and slows down. It circles around the outside for a bit and then changes direction to the center and is pulled out by the vacuum that vents to atmosphere. Originally designed for a shopvac, I am trying a leaf blower. I am using 2 inch lines of PVC and 1.5 drain hose to keep velocity high under vacuum. Most of the debris sucked in rolls to the outside and drops into the bottom of the drum. The reduced air weight at running volumes help cause the separation, along with the speed change in the larger drum area. So far only finest dust is expelled, and only a portion of the volume that is inhaled.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.

pace8
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Post by pace8 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:28 am

Is this one of the "paper bag over a foam sleeve" type? and the paper bag is whats clogging?

I got one of the monster "Shop-vacs" and quickly was ready to throw it away, dang thing would clog the paper filter so quickly as to make is almost useless. Finally one day the paper was so ragged it wasnt gonna take another cleaning and I needed the thing, so I went back with just the foam sock .... doggone if I wasnt able to finish up the messy job with the thing sucking like crazy. On inspection of the foam it wasnt all that bad and it appeared it was covering things up pretty well, so... that was 3-4yrs ago and its still going.

I figure I wasnt getting any use out of it anyway and if the dust gets by the foam and shortens the life of the motor --- well, at least I've had some use out of it ...... so far no indication of any probs! I'll clean/blow/knock off the sock occasionally -- doesnt seem to make any difference even when I do!

Kinda odd, my son got a big Sears thats very similar to the Shop-vac and he never has a problem with the paper bag....go figure.

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millman5
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Post by millman5 » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:39 am

Both of my vacs use the pleated filters @ 7.00 or so. I tried a 5 HP double cloth bag shop (saw)dust collector. Works pretty good but requires pre sweeping with a broom (even more airborne dust). Sounds like armageddon if a small sliver of metal or small bolt/nut gets to the squirrel cage.

Even though the 5 HP dust collector moves many cu.ft. of air it really doesn't have the suction of a shop vac. There fore doesn'y pick up as good for sweeping.
If it works Don't fix it....

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Sun Jun 22, 2008 4:19 pm

I made one from a grease drum
My Vacuum system is outside to keep noise down, but my drum keeps almost all the dirt and chips inside for cleaning every 6 months.
I soft soldered a 2 inch copper pipe tangent to the drum.
I took the cover, with the center suction (PVC) and mounted a coffee can deflector, so the chips spin around, but lighter air and a bit of dust will go down and then up inside, while the heavier chips and dirt follow the wall to the bottom.

The drum is not conical, like most collectors, but does not need to be. I added a heavy weighted air flow restrainer at the bottom . When the air hits it, it slows down and drops the chips. The retrainer looks like a flag, and I leave it with about one inch space from the inside wall, just to add drag.
The photo shows it at a angle, but I generally have it at right angles to flow.
This unit comes apart very easy using the original barrel ring clamp,and because the suction pipe is in the lid with push fit PVC ( No Glue !) I can pick up the drum to dump it.
I have to remember to retrieve the restrainer however, even if it is only scrap.
Rich
Attachments
Shop Vacuum Container2.jpg
Shop Vacuum Container.jpg

JHanko
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Post by JHanko » Mon Jun 23, 2008 12:03 am

Image

That's one hell of a vacuum to suck that steel plate through the hose!

Jeff

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steamin10
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Post by steamin10 » Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:32 am

Thats the same as I described only with a 55 gal drum. Nice Work!

The leaf blower is overkill and noisy, but works good. I will try the catch bar and see if it improves things when I fire this thing up.

I got the blower from a local pawn that handles tools.
Big Dave, former Millwright, Electrician, Environmental conditioning, and back yard Fixxit guy. Now retired, persuing boats, trains, and broken relics.
We have enough youth, how about a fountain of Smart. My computer beat me at chess, but not kickboxing
It is not getting caught in the rain, its learning to dance in it. People saying good morning, should have to prove it.

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:23 pm

My Vacuum outside is a cheapo Sears shopVac, ( 3/4 HP ?)
The inside chip/dust collector takes out the vast majority of stuff, so the shopvac outside maintains a high level of suction for a long time
It has one of those corrigated filters ( 200 sq ft area ?),not a bag !
Rich

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pat1027
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Post by pat1027 » Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:54 am

Wood magazine ran an article on building a cyclone seperator several years ago.

gzig5
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Post by gzig5 » Tue Jun 24, 2008 11:05 am

Here is a smaller version from that fellow in Japan.

http://homepage3.nifty.com/amigos/57_cy ... ctor-e.htm
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t-IMG_0300.jpg

pkastagehand
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Post by pkastagehand » Tue Jun 24, 2008 11:08 am

Lindsay Publications used to have a book (seems like it was one of the Gingery books) on building blowers, etc. It seems like there may have been a section in that on a cyclone unit but I don't remember for sure and don't know if they still have the book available or not.

http://www.lindsaybks.com/prod/index.html

No connection to them other than having bought a few books from them over the years.

Paul

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millman5
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Post by millman5 » Mon Jun 30, 2008 3:21 pm

Thanks all for the help I'll try something even if it ends up in the junk bin.
If it works Don't fix it....

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