The Lamp Shade - RETURNS!

Sheet Metal Fabrication techniques, questions and help. "Tricks of the Trade"

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Lee
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS! - still learning!

Post by Lee » Wed Nov 19, 2003 4:34 pm

Nice work Jacin [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/cool.gif"%20alt="[/img] How did you make out with the material thickness on the big end this time?
I always like to learn, but I don't always like to be taught.

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Jacin
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS! - still learning!

Post by Jacin » Wed Nov 19, 2003 5:57 pm

Thanks Lee, I think I finally figured out the thickness "trick".

One fella told me to stroke TOWARDS the HEADSTOCK - THINS

While stroking TOWARDS the TAILSTOCK - THICKENS.

And while I totally agree with that in principle - I found out it is a bit more complicated than that (not too complicated)

Once I started to approach it from a "metalshapers" perspective I started to make the metal do more what I wanted. For instance by making the whole part a sort of cone and then working this cone down I found controlling the thickness much easier. My biggest mistake prior was trying to just keep working a little bit each time. My biggest improvement was thinking about it like "throwing" a clay pot.

Believe me I am not trying to sound like I actually know what I am doing - 'cause I don't BUT I am learning - even if my setup is somewhat unconventional I think I am beginning to understand it just a bit!!!!

I must admit it is AWFULLY neat to watch a flat piece of scrap be turned into something 3 dimensional and useful.

I LEARNED something this week - it was a GOOD week!!!!!

D_R
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS! - still learning!

Post by D_R » Fri Nov 21, 2003 1:02 pm

One thing that helped me was the advice to spin towards the headstock to "break" the disk. Spin towards the tailstock to get it to conform to the mandrel.

Brian_h
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS! - still learning!

Post by Brian_h » Sat Nov 22, 2003 9:10 am

What about annealing? do you do that on the lathe while it is spinning? Or do you have to remove it from the setup each time. Is a small propane torch enough heat?

Brian

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Marty_Escarcega
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS!

Post by Marty_Escarcega » Sat Nov 22, 2003 9:41 am

Make sure you check out a friends website. He recently had a run of articles in Home Shop Machinist on Metal Spinning. Several of us went to his home in Tucson to try our hands at spinning. I ended up with a copper ashtray that I made. :-)

Yes, you do anneal, take it off the machine.

His website and he has a CD with tons of great info.
http://www.jamesriser.com/CD_Preview/Intro.html

Make sure you check out the rest of his site. This guy is truly talented.
http://www.jamesriser.com

Marty
"Jack of all Trades, Master of None"

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Jacin
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Re: The Lamp Shade - RETURNS! - still learning!

Post by Jacin » Sat Nov 22, 2003 7:22 pm

Hi Brian,

Well In my initial efforts I annealed both on and off the lathe. Later on I found out I wasn't in need of so much annealing - I was just a bit gun shy - I guess.

However today I was spinning some copper tubing (kinda heavy) and of course the copper seamed to work harden much faster than the aluminum so I did some quick annealing with my hand help propane torch while it was spinning - it was quicker than chucking and unchucking all the time.

In any event I would ANNEAL FIRST - you can then sorta get a feel for if it suddenly becomes difficult to "move" - then remove and re anneal. I think this is where experience starts to come into play - you get a feeling for just how much you can work the metal before - you need to stop and anneal again. My last lamp shade was only annealed once for the entire shape. - I then annealed only the edge because I wanted to roll it back over itself and I was concerned if I had worked it too much - maybe I didn't need this spot annealing - but I wanted to be safe rather than sorry.


I have heard several people tell me that the Jim that Marty referred to is publishing a how to book - they also say he's quite the expert - I've seen his work - he is definitely Top Shelf.

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Jacin
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Well this ain't no lamp shade -

Post by Jacin » Wed Nov 26, 2003 10:57 pm

I was fooling around with some copper water pipe and first just wanted to see if I could spin it down to a point - later I kept fiddling and ended up with this - hey don't laugh - I think I might try to rig up some sorta of base and call it a vase and give it to Gramma for X-Mas (they LOVE that sorta thing) - she ALWAYS tells us NOT to BUY her anything so I guess this is one way of getting around that!

Still looking for ideas on the base - any artsy opinions would be great - as you can see I need all the help I can get!

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icemaker
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Re: Well this ain't no lamp shade -

Post by icemaker » Thu Nov 27, 2003 10:22 am

Jacin,

Pretty neat! What did you use as a form to spin this on? I am assuming that the form had the bell mouth radius on it and the straight section. But it would seem that it would have to end there, since you wouldn't be able to get the part off if it had the grooves on it. Did you do the grooves and the point free form? That is, with no internal support to form against?

Happy Thanksgiving,
Bill

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icemaker
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Re: Well this ain't no lamp shade -

Post by icemaker » Thu Nov 27, 2003 10:27 am

Hey Jacin I forgot to put an idea for a base in my last post. How about a slab of polished stone to imbed the tip of the vase in. Have your wife make up a small bouquet of minature silk flowers to place in it and you're ready for Christmas. Heck, you might want to start selling them on eBay.

Bill

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Jacin
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Re: Well this ain't no lamp shade -

Post by Jacin » Thu Nov 27, 2003 11:02 am

Hi Bill, Happy Thanksgiving to you as well!!!

I REALLY like the stone base idea.

I spun this with no internal support - I did have a plug that I only used to support where the chuck jaws clamped on the tube.
I first did the tapered end then flipped it over to bell mouth that side - then "clamping plug" just fell out when I was done - I was hoping that would be the case - but I wasn't sure.
Doing this all "free form" I noticed that it does get sorta warped especially on those HEAVY forming areas - so what I ended up doing was to go back over the form every so often to keep it running true - only mattered when I was REALLY pushing things.

Thanks for your suggestions - I really like them.

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Lee
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Mounting suggestion

Post by Lee » Sun Nov 30, 2003 10:13 am

That looks pretty decent Jacin! It almost looks as if you could play a tune on it [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/cool.gif"%20alt="[/img] Have you considered mounting it vertically to a wall plaque? If you used a piece of copper tubing in a " C= " shape, and held it from the topmost concave area, you could run a couple of screws through the back of the wall plaque into the ends of the tube to hold it on. It could then be hung on the wall. Just a thought [img]/ubb/images/graemlins/grin.gif"%20alt="[/img]
I always like to learn, but I don't always like to be taught.

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Jacin
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Speaking of tunes

Post by Jacin » Sun Nov 30, 2003 10:31 pm

Thanks Lee - I like that suggestion !!!

Speaking of tunes.....here's some Chritmas Bell's I plan on giving this year - they are basically the same - I did take some artistic license and changed the bell section slightly here and there - trying to discover which shape Iiked better. Still need a little finish work - but at least this year I am gonna be ready (for once!)

Believe it or not they actually sound pretty good too!!!

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