Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

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Bill Shields
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Bill Shields » Mon May 24, 2021 8:17 pm

Interesting that there is no measurable voltage but still an effect.

Have you tried a DC ammeter? Requires a shunt..typically not something you can clamp on

So.ething is going on and I bet it is not Harry Potter
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Harold_V » Tue May 25, 2021 1:06 am

Jay79 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 6:46 pm
Bill, no there is no measurable voltage on any of the terminals but there is continuity. Torch, If I Disconnect "U", the motor no longer turns hard with "W" or "V" but with it connected Both "W" and "V" individually or together cause a hard turning motor.
Hmmmm. If there's no measurable voltage, I wonder if, maybe, the motor is producing the voltage that makes the motor hard to turn. If it is, it should offer greater resistance as you turn it faster. Have you given that a try?

H
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Torch
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Torch » Tue May 25, 2021 2:36 am

Jay79 wrote:
Mon May 24, 2021 6:46 pm
Bill, no there is no measurable voltage on any of the terminals but there is continuity. Torch, If I Disconnect "U", the motor no longer turns hard with "W" or "V" but with it connected Both "W" and "V" individually or together cause a hard turning motor.
Ok, so definitely associated with one of the 3 legs. Now, to establish if the issue is in the controller, or the motor.

Let's reorder the wires, for diagnosis. So, blue is connected to terminal U, grey to W, red to V normally. Right now, disconnecting blue from U allows the motor to turn freely. Disconnecting either grey from W or red from V makes no difference.

Try connecting blue to W, grey to V and red to U. Now lift the wires one at a time and see if the free turning follows the wire or the terminal. If the motor still turns freely when the wire connected to U is disconnected, then the problem is with the controller. If the motor still turns freely when the grey wire is disconnected, then the problem is in the motor.

(edited to change wire numbers to colours, as per the schematic provided earlier)
Last edited by Torch on Tue May 25, 2021 6:16 am, edited 2 times in total.

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liveaboard
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by liveaboard » Tue May 25, 2021 3:53 am

That sounds reasonable.

The thing is, whether it be the motor or whether it be the controller, I suspect your best course is going to be the same; a standard 3-phase motor and compatible VFD.

Because those items are mass produced and applicable to many things they're competitively priced, and you'll no longer be bound to one manufacturer or another.
If one part fails in future, it can be replaced from any one of many suppliers.
And diagnostics are standard too.

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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Torch » Tue May 25, 2021 6:11 am

Buying a new motor and controller seems premature. 220v 1500w BLDC controllers are not particularly rare or expensive. Here's the first one that popped up on google:

https://www.google.com/search?q=220v+15 ... 8&oe=utf-8

There are others. The going price seems to be around $100 bucks plus shipping. Mostly from the orient, though, but then, so are many (most?) VFD controllers.

At this point, I still think it's possible all he needs is to swap out a transistor (or 3).

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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by rrnut-2 » Tue May 25, 2021 12:57 pm

Ok, what you have is a BLDC motor and controller. A BLDC motor is built like a servo motor only without an encoder. It has hall effect sensors to determine motor pole position. Most of these have gone by the wayside because a servo motor system can be had for the same price, and the BLDC systems are not known for their reliability.

You have the 3 motor leads and you should have smaller leads that go to the sensors. What you are seeing with the motor leads shorted is correct; short any 2 of the 3 leads and the motor gets hard to turn. An AC servo motor will do the same thing. This tells me that the motor is good. The controller more than likely is defective. A replacement controller can be had from Invertek, https://www.wolfautomation.com/ac-drive ... v-1-phase/, that should work.

I say should because I started converting a Novakon CNC mill to Centroid that had this same spindle motor system. I am limited on space for the motor, so that is why I am replacing the controller/drive. I have the drive, but due to health issues, I have not been able to get back into the shop to test it since November, but getting close.

Jim B

Torch
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Torch » Tue May 25, 2021 1:28 pm

rrnut-2 wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 12:57 pm
A replacement controller can be had from Invertek, https://www.wolfautomation.com/ac-drive ... v-1-phase/, that should work.
Are you sure that is the right link? That controller appears to be a VFD for a sensorless AC motor.

rrnut-2
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by rrnut-2 » Tue May 25, 2021 1:35 pm

Under "More Information", "Control Method":

Sensorless Vector Speed Control
PM Vector Control
BLDC Control
Synchronous Reluctance

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Torch
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Torch » Tue May 25, 2021 1:59 pm

Oh, ok, I see that now.

However, it also says 120v input. The schematic of the Smithy one indicates it is 220v input. Better verify the voltage first!

rrnut-2
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by rrnut-2 » Tue May 25, 2021 3:36 pm

They are also available in 208-240vac. But ya, verify voltage and hp. Also, if you have room for a regular 3ph motor, I would use that solution first.

Jim B

Jay79
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Re: Smithy Granite 1324-I MX Help

Post by Jay79 » Wed Jun 02, 2021 12:58 pm

OK, a big Thanks to all of you for your time and knowledge. I will be looking into that Invertek drive.

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