Turnout detents?

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rkcarguy
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Turnout detents?

Post by rkcarguy »

I'm curious what you guys do for turnout detents? I'm looking to be able to throw the switch via a ground lever like some of those on the White Creek RR video's, so I don't have to get on and off the riding car all the time. I'd like to spring load the switches as well so when I re-enter the main line, I can simply drive through the points. Note that I am building in 2" scale. I'd love to see some pictures if you have some. I've drawn a little parts kit up in CAD for a welded version of this:
switch stand.jpg
switch stand.jpg (29.57 KiB) Viewed 9374 times
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NP317
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by NP317 »

Kitsap Live Steamers has good remote manual switch machines. Spring switches, too.
They have been installed throughout Train Mountain RR.
'Should be able to scale them up nicely, and KLS is at least in your same State.
~RN
rkcarguy
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by rkcarguy »

https://www.greatnortherncascaderailway ... Plates.pdf

This is pretty good. Looks like ultimately I'll have to play with the springs a bit to get it to work right for my scale though. Too light and a wheel may pick the points, too heavy and I could derail my empty rolling stock running back onto the main.
rkcarguy
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by rkcarguy »

Page 14 has the kick switch detent on it, that's what I was looking for. I should be able to use a variant of that together with the switch stand and it will work.
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NP317
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by NP317 »

Ahh yes. Curt Young's treatise on switch building is a priceless document. Thanks for posting the link.

Page 14 shows the kick switch. The "fixed tang" part now has a better version getting installed at KLS:
There is a small roller on the point. Works better and helps prevents the switch getting stuck in a partial position.
KLS member (and former Boeing Engineer) George Hoke has been working on these designs. Likely other people too.
Worth a look.
~RN
ccvstmr
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by ccvstmr »

If you go back in the Disc. Live Steam archives...believe it was Issues 29 & 30 that was a 2 part series on "assembling" turnouts. Nothing was really mentioned about the turnout design per se. The use of jigs, fixtures and gauges will go a long way towards repeatability in your turnout construction.

1st thing you, as the railroad builder will need to decide...do you want your turnouts to be "model" turnouts (smaller versions of the real deal)...or are you willing to sacrifice some traditional RR practices for a "functional" turnout? This comes into place when considering tie spacing, switch point material selection, length of switch points and other factors. Do you want to put a little more time into preparing parts up front to accelerate turnout assembly later on...or vice versa? What type of switch point throw mechanism do you want? There's lots of designs to choose from starting with the White Creek "hockey puck" kick switch stand and many other ground throw type mechanism versions...to high stands placed some 20 feet in advance of the switch...to electric switch motors with advance button control.

You'll find that every facet of the turnout will have multiple ways to accomplish the end result. Keep us posted of your progress. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
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rkcarguy
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by rkcarguy »

Well, I have a turnout partially assembled in my garage. I'm using the groovy track method and have been using a router to groove my ties. I drew the turnout in CAD, so I have a cut list for all the tie lengths, and simply let the excess stick out one end of the tie router fixture and grooved the straight portion of the turnout. I have a laser cut router fixture that is curved for the diverging route, which I need to simply align and screw to the ties then router down each side of it. It's still a few weeks out though until it's made.
The point rails will be the hardest part, I haven't decided yet if I'll machine them from square bar or carefully miter cut and TIG weld a custom piece from plates.
I figured out how much throw I need at the turnout, added 1/4" more throw each way for spring pressure. Then I drew my switch stand so that the target turns 90* at this throw. I think I pretty much have it figured out minus the detent part, which now I have some examples of how that is being done. I do want to add some ground rods so that I can throw the switch in advance, by adding a slotted plate to the drawbar beside the rails this will be easy enough to add.
At this point, I'll need 3 LH turnouts for "phase 1" of my build. The "workshop spur", the "firewood to the house" spur, and the spur to the locomotive shed.
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chiloquinruss
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by chiloquinruss »

Copied from our website under Tutorials:
http://trainmtn.org/tmrr/Resources/tuto ... rial-r.pdf
Mattchoo Z
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by Mattchoo Z »

I hope nobody minds but I'm going to piggyback on this thread a little bit since I've kind of been putting the thought in people's ears of manual remote switches at Chula Vista Live Steamers.

Russ that is awesome info on the switch linkage setup, thank you for posting that. Do you or anybody else have the plans/dimensions or any other info on the actual switch stands? Or do you have the contact info for the individual at Kitsap or TM that builds them?

I've been trying to figure out how to try and make them somewhat removable as CVLS is in a public park and the less opportunities for trouble makers to smash stuff the better.
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NP317
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by NP317 »

KLS has removable switch stands, also due to the public park home.
Contact KLS for more info.
https://kls.clubexpress.com/content.asp ... =947556240

~RN
rkcarguy
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by rkcarguy »

I drew up a switch stand kit today that will eventually be laser cut, combining some of features seen in these links. Mine is basically a kick switch that also drives a stand to show the turnout position, instead of the stand actually moving the turnout.
Where the draw bar extends out the side of the turnout, I left myself a couple of holes so I can attach an angle with a slot in it so it can be manually changed with a "ground bar".
For a vandal resistant version, I would recommend to make the base very stout. A coupler nut could be welded to the shaft that sits flush with the top of the "casting" portion. Then, a socket would be welded to a upper shaft, handle, and finally the colored disc(s), which would simply be lifted out and stored away.
While we are on this subject, how do you guys typically size your switch stands? Most of the tallest ones I've seen are maybe 1'-2' taller than a man. That's only 12" tall in 1/8 scale (1.5").
I'm modeling in 2", so I am planning on anywhere from 18-24" tall.
Pontiacguy1
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Re: Turnout detents?

Post by Pontiacguy1 »

I guess my opinion is that it should be easy to move and get to, and then worry about the size of it. Put it so that you can reach it easily and it will make operating your railroad a whole lot more enjoyable. I've seen some scale switch throws where you had to bend over, lift the handle, turn the switch, then put the handle back down in a slot. they look neat, but after a while of switching cars and running operations, that becomes a pain in the butt... or back. Something you can throw without having to bend over for yards, if it is a main line switch, something you can throw without getting off the train. Whatever height and shape that needs to be, well, that's what I'd make it.
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