Drilling small holes

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Mr Ron
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Drilling small holes

Post by Mr Ron » Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:33 pm

I received this post which may be of interest. https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/g ... er-137349/
Mr.Ron from South Mississippi

pete
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by pete » Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:19 pm

Thanks for the link Ron. Some of those accounts I've run across before about one upmanship between country's or manufacturer's apparently done sometime in the 1950's and 60's. No one seems able to verify how true they are or the correct actual details. I'm sure there's some truth to it, except which one or part of any story is true? Some of the others are more than impressive about how small we can now go. 10 atoms in size is damn small. :-)

Mr Ron
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Mr Ron » Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:30 pm

pete wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:19 pm
Thanks for the link Ron. Some of those accounts I've run across before about one upmanship between country's or manufacturer's apparently done sometime in the 1950's and 60's. No one seems able to verify how true they are or the correct actual details. I'm sure there's some truth to it, except which one or part of any story is true? Some of the others are more than impressive about how small we can now go. 10 atoms in size is damn small. :-)
Sounds like it may be a take on the fisherman's tall tale about how large the fish was that got away. Probably started out as a hole drilled in an 1/8" bit with a 1/16" bit. Maybe Harold may know some actual cases.
Mr.Ron from South Mississippi

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Bill Shields
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Bill Shields » Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:34 pm

Irrespective of holes and urban legends

i have personally worked with 0.4 mm diameter end mills
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

whateg0
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by whateg0 » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:37 pm

Bill Shields wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:34 pm
Irrespective of holes and urban legends

i have personally worked with 0.4 mm diameter end mills
Is that how fdm printer nozzles are made?

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Bill Shields
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Bill Shields » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:43 pm

No sure. What i was working on was not printer nozzles -> something medical/dental. Was getting very small wire put through the hole before coating in some sort of insulation.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

pete
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by pete » Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:35 pm

How easy or hard was that size of end mill to work with Bill? CNC might not be too bad, but on a manual mill I've always wondered if it would be possible or they would just break.

I have a set of solid carbide boring bars meant to be used in a boring head and could also be used on a lathe I suppose. The smallest is capable of starting in a .050" hole. The larger one's do work great, but so far I've not had the guts to use the two smallest one's. At $45 each they would make a fairly expensive sound if/when I break one. If money is no object PH Horn in Europe have some really small cutting tools.

Jerry Kieffer has made the taps and dies, heat treated and then produced working nuts & bolts on a lowly Shereline manual lathe to just under .010" in diameter with if I remember correctly over 300 tpi. His 1/30th scale Corliss stationary engine he used them on is mind boggling it could even be made and operate as well as it does. https://www.craftsmanshipmuseum.com/Kieffer.htm

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Bill Shields
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Bill Shields » Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:41 pm

Not manual for sure.

Was in a Tornos Swiss with a 120000 rpm spindle driving it. Very touchy to even setup in the spindle.

Once cutting parameters known...cut like any other milling cutter.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Wed Sep 15, 2021 8:54 pm

Yes Pete, Jerry does awesome work. His Harley is like seeing gold..
There is a lot of talk about really small stuff, but you have to look at the Tools being used I believe.
One of the greatest feats I have seen was a .090" diameter roller being made by one of the best machinists I have ever worked with.
But wait you say ! anyone can do that !
Well, it was a major breakdown in the production plant I worked in and I was on Midnight shift and came in , and all hands were on deck.
And here was Frank. making a roller for a miniature Cherry Switch.....on a 24 inch lathe

Rich

pete
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by pete » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:41 am

Thanks Bill, about what I expected. Roughly 4k tops on my BP clone and while my dro can give me what the feed rate is. With an offshore power feed I can count out even trying it.

Your too modest Rich, I'd put you right up there with Jerry. And the Shereline Museum of Craftsmanship does as well. A .090" pin on a 24" lathe? I sure couldn't, or not without more than a few tries at it, and even then I'd bet against being successful.

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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Harold_V » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:26 am

Mr Ron wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:30 pm
Maybe Harold may know some actual cases.
Nope!
I'm of the opinion that none of it is true. I've heard several of these far-fetched tales in my many years.
Sort of brings to mind the old story about a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy who has a pill that you drop in your gas tank, then add water. Very conveniently, always a guy or two too deep to verify.

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, flies like a duck, pretty good chance it's a duck.

For what ever reason, humans seem to be enamored by absurd stories.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

Harold_V
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Re: Drilling small holes

Post by Harold_V » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:32 am

pete wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:41 am
A .090" pin on a 24" lathe? I sure couldn't, or not without more than a few tries at it, and even then I'd bet against being successful.
Not to make little of the accomplishment, it's not all that big of a deal.
Many years ago, when I operated my machines for gain, one of the tools I built for Litton Guidance & Control required six pieces of what I recall to be 5/8" diameter free machining brass with a .030" diameter extension 5/8" long. Sounds impossible, but they were quite easy to make (turned from bar stock) with my 12" Graziano, top spindle speed of only 2,000 rpm.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

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