I have a Clausing lathe with variable speed. Model number 5901. All the oil has leaked out so the speed can not be changed. Also the chuck has some runout and may need the headstock rebuilt.
Does anyone have repair information on this? I would like to rebuild it and get it running again.
Thanks,
Doug
Can not change variable speed
-
Love4Steam
- Posts: 42
- Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:38 pm
- Location: Garden Grove, CA
Re: Can not change variable speed
Hi There,
I haven't run into a 5901 before but I am pretty familiar with the
5900 series lathes. Do you know where your hydraulic leak is
from? Once you have fixed it, bleeding the air out of the system
shouldn't be too difficult. The bleeding instructions are in the
manual. If you don't have a manual, you can get Clausing In-
dustrial to send you a PDF copy if you contact them and give them
the model and serial number for your lathe for free.
I am the assistant moderator on the Yahoo CLausing Lathe and Mill
Group. I made a Group purchase of seals for these lathes and I still
have some seal kits left; if you need them. Rebuilding the cylinders
is straight forward. If you need help, I can walk you through it.
The runout in the chuck is a different matter. I doubt you need to have
the headstock rebuilt. Your runout is most likely in the chuck itself.
If you have a good dial indicator, you can check the runout of the L00
spindle taper (external). How much runout does your chuck have?
If it is a 3-jaw chuck, runout of up to .003" is not uncommon. It can
be even worse as the chuck wears. For real high accuracy work, one
typically uses a 4-jaw chuck.
If your spindle is bent (very unlikely, because the 5900 spindle is very
strong), then rebuilding it will be very expensive and probably cost more
than you paid for the whole lathe (I can feel Steve Graham warming-up
for a tirade in my bones). I've never priced a spindle from Clausing but
if you do, be prepared for some serious sticker shock. Bearings for the
spindle will be a shocker too (but you can get better prices from an in-
dependent bearing supplier once you know the bearing numbers).
Anyway, dismount your chuck and check the spindle runout first. And
send me a PM if you are interested in seal kits for your hydraulic cylinders.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
I haven't run into a 5901 before but I am pretty familiar with the
5900 series lathes. Do you know where your hydraulic leak is
from? Once you have fixed it, bleeding the air out of the system
shouldn't be too difficult. The bleeding instructions are in the
manual. If you don't have a manual, you can get Clausing In-
dustrial to send you a PDF copy if you contact them and give them
the model and serial number for your lathe for free.
I am the assistant moderator on the Yahoo CLausing Lathe and Mill
Group. I made a Group purchase of seals for these lathes and I still
have some seal kits left; if you need them. Rebuilding the cylinders
is straight forward. If you need help, I can walk you through it.
The runout in the chuck is a different matter. I doubt you need to have
the headstock rebuilt. Your runout is most likely in the chuck itself.
If you have a good dial indicator, you can check the runout of the L00
spindle taper (external). How much runout does your chuck have?
If it is a 3-jaw chuck, runout of up to .003" is not uncommon. It can
be even worse as the chuck wears. For real high accuracy work, one
typically uses a 4-jaw chuck.
If your spindle is bent (very unlikely, because the 5900 spindle is very
strong), then rebuilding it will be very expensive and probably cost more
than you paid for the whole lathe (I can feel Steve Graham warming-up
for a tirade in my bones). I've never priced a spindle from Clausing but
if you do, be prepared for some serious sticker shock. Bearings for the
spindle will be a shocker too (but you can get better prices from an in-
dependent bearing supplier once you know the bearing numbers).
Anyway, dismount your chuck and check the spindle runout first. And
send me a PM if you are interested in seal kits for your hydraulic cylinders.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
-
SteveHGraham
- Posts: 7788
- Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:55 pm
- Location: Florida
Re: Can not change variable speed
Thought I heard something.
Every hard-fried egg began life sunny-side up.
-
Love4Steam
- Posts: 42
- Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:38 pm
- Location: Garden Grove, CA
Re: Can not change variable speed
I contacted Clausing and they sent me the manual with part numbers. I suspect the leak is in the seals as you said. Most likely the lower cylinder as there is oil on it. I will fill the resivoir and see where it is leaking from. What is your price on the new seals?
I mis led you on the spindle run out. The issue is when a light cut is made and the pass is repeated with out feeding the cutter into the work, more metal is removed in the cut where htere should be no metal removed. This made me think about the bearings. Is there a good way to inspect them?
I mis led you on the spindle run out. The issue is when a light cut is made and the pass is repeated with out feeding the cutter into the work, more metal is removed in the cut where htere should be no metal removed. This made me think about the bearings. Is there a good way to inspect them?
Re: Can not change variable speed
I can't help on other issues, but the re-cutting on a second pass is what some folks refer to as a "spring pass", and is normal. The first thing to know is that EVERYTHING flexes, and everything moves. When you make a cut, depending on the tool chosen (edge, presentation, clearance, material, etc), the material being cut (hard, soft, machinability, aspect ratio, unsupported length, etc), and the machine in use (how rigid are the castings, wear, adjustment, etc) as well as speed/feed (and other things) you will get more or less of this for different cuts. Because there are so many variables, predicting it can be difficult, and it may cut a little more with each of a series of passes (no guarantee one "spring pass" will be enough).
The general approach for precision turning is to set up for some repeated cuts as you begin finish work. Measure the result of each cut when it's made, and use that to gauge small changes in in-feed for subsequent cuts so that you can hit your desired tolerance on the final pass. Because each of the ranging cuts is made with only slight changes in depth of cut, that eliminates as many variables as possible providing a good chance of hitting very tight tolerances once you get the hang of things.
That said, there are other limits to be aware off, in particular the amount of unsupported length in the work piece, and contributing factors that may be generating excessive cutting pressures that add to your problem. There are also cases where things like too much rake on the tool (or material characteristics) causes the bit to pull into the work. That will take up any slack in the stack (cross, compound, etc) and can sometimes even develop an alternating push-pull oscillation, which is different from what is known as "chatter". It's not nearly as bad as it may sound, but there are a lot of things that can contribute to problems like you describe. Best thing is to get the machine working properly, then spend time learning how to use it, ideally with a local mentor who can help you up the initial learning curve.
The general approach for precision turning is to set up for some repeated cuts as you begin finish work. Measure the result of each cut when it's made, and use that to gauge small changes in in-feed for subsequent cuts so that you can hit your desired tolerance on the final pass. Because each of the ranging cuts is made with only slight changes in depth of cut, that eliminates as many variables as possible providing a good chance of hitting very tight tolerances once you get the hang of things.
That said, there are other limits to be aware off, in particular the amount of unsupported length in the work piece, and contributing factors that may be generating excessive cutting pressures that add to your problem. There are also cases where things like too much rake on the tool (or material characteristics) causes the bit to pull into the work. That will take up any slack in the stack (cross, compound, etc) and can sometimes even develop an alternating push-pull oscillation, which is different from what is known as "chatter". It's not nearly as bad as it may sound, but there are a lot of things that can contribute to problems like you describe. Best thing is to get the machine working properly, then spend time learning how to use it, ideally with a local mentor who can help you up the initial learning curve.
Russ
Master Floor Sweeper
Master Floor Sweeper
Re: Can not change variable speed
Hi There,
The 5900 series used a couple different styles of cylinders.
The early (old) style were made from steel tubing and are
cylindrical in shape. The later (new) style were made from
aluminum blocks and are rectangular in shape. This is how
it breaks down:
Master (Upper) Cylinder
Old Style - $8.15
New Style - $4.15
Slave (Lower) Cylinder
Old Style - $13.60
New Style - $12.50
If you are unsure of which type you have, post a picture and
I'll let you know. Please be aware that some lathes can have
a mixture of old and new style cylinders. Usually, this mixture
is old style master cylinder and a new style slave cylinder. The
old style slave cylinders were somewhat problematic and when
Clausing stopped supporting the old style, they made an upgrade
kit to convert older lathes over to the newer style slave cylinders.
Shipping is $4.00 for the first seal kit and $.65 extra for each
additional kit ordered at the same time. PayPal is my preferred
way of accepting payment.
All seals and O-rings are Made In USA! No Chinese junk.
When it comes to your other machining question, BadDog pretty much hit the
nail on the head and I don't have anymore to add on that point.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
It depends which type of hydraulic cylinders you have.Love4Steam wrote:I suspect the leak is in the seals as you said. Most likely the lower cylinder as there is oil on it. I will fill the resivoir and see where it is leaking from. What is your price on the new seals?
The 5900 series used a couple different styles of cylinders.
The early (old) style were made from steel tubing and are
cylindrical in shape. The later (new) style were made from
aluminum blocks and are rectangular in shape. This is how
it breaks down:
Master (Upper) Cylinder
Old Style - $8.15
New Style - $4.15
Slave (Lower) Cylinder
Old Style - $13.60
New Style - $12.50
If you are unsure of which type you have, post a picture and
I'll let you know. Please be aware that some lathes can have
a mixture of old and new style cylinders. Usually, this mixture
is old style master cylinder and a new style slave cylinder. The
old style slave cylinders were somewhat problematic and when
Clausing stopped supporting the old style, they made an upgrade
kit to convert older lathes over to the newer style slave cylinders.
Shipping is $4.00 for the first seal kit and $.65 extra for each
additional kit ordered at the same time. PayPal is my preferred
way of accepting payment.
All seals and O-rings are Made In USA! No Chinese junk.
When it comes to your other machining question, BadDog pretty much hit the
nail on the head and I don't have anymore to add on that point.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
Re: Can not change variable speed
Oh, yeah! Big time!BadDog wrote:(no guarantee one "spring pass" will be enough).
If one is not familiar with proper machining techniques and cutting tool geometry, you may be expecting far more from a turn than it is capable of providing, even if you had a new Monarch EE at your disposal. So many variables are at play that it borders on the impossible for anyone to provide a clear and concise answer.
I agree whole-heartedly. Take each operation a step at a time, so you can isolate problems that may arise.Best thing is to get the machine working properly, then spend time learning how to use it, ideally with a local mentor who can help you up the initial learning curve.
A couple things to think about. A chuck that is sprung may not lend the required support. That can yield the very issue you've mentioned. It's a good idea to chuck up a piece of material, then determine where the jaws make contact. If they grip at the outer edge, you're golden. However, if you see daylight at the outer ends of the jaws, between the gripping surface and the material, the chuck is sprung. Could be from a crash, or even from just being used beyond a useful life.
I make mention of this because a rule of thumb for you to remember is that one should not attempt to machine an object that projects more than three times its diameter in length, from the ends of the jaws. If it exceeds that length, you should expect deflection, and the worse the cutting tool geometry, the more pronounced the problem. Using negative rake inserts, for example, is not an acceptable method in this instance, as, by the nature of negative rake, cutting pressure is high. That's sure to deflect the part in question.
When one experiences deflection from a sprung chuck, it's not unusual for the turn to be three lobed. It will usually deflect more between the jaws than in line with the jaws, because the jaw grips only a short portion of the material, resulting in the part wallowing in the chuck.
Harold
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
-
Love4Steam
- Posts: 42
- Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:38 pm
- Location: Garden Grove, CA
Re: Can not change variable speed
Here are pics of the cylinders:
- Lower cylinder
- Upper cylinder
Re: Can not change variable speed
Hi There,
Okay, you have an early 5900 with the 3 v-belt drive
instead of the cog belt drive. You have the old style
master and slave cylinders. So, you would need the
rebuild kits for the old style cylinders.
Is your motor's VS pulley accessed from the left side of
the headstock pedestal or on the right hand side of the
headstock pedestal (under the chip pan)? It doesn't make
any difference to the kits. I'm just curious if your lathe is
a first generation 5900 or a very early second generation.
Anyway, if you want kits for your cylinders, you can send
me a "private message." If you do not know how to do this,
at the bottom of each post, there are a couple of rectangular
boxes; one says "profile" the other says "pm" (private message).
That way, we can exchange info without bothering the rest of
The Group.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
Okay, you have an early 5900 with the 3 v-belt drive
instead of the cog belt drive. You have the old style
master and slave cylinders. So, you would need the
rebuild kits for the old style cylinders.
Is your motor's VS pulley accessed from the left side of
the headstock pedestal or on the right hand side of the
headstock pedestal (under the chip pan)? It doesn't make
any difference to the kits. I'm just curious if your lathe is
a first generation 5900 or a very early second generation.
Anyway, if you want kits for your cylinders, you can send
me a "private message." If you do not know how to do this,
at the bottom of each post, there are a couple of rectangular
boxes; one says "profile" the other says "pm" (private message).
That way, we can exchange info without bothering the rest of
The Group.
Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb
Re: Can not change variable speed
Hello guys, new member here.It depends which type of hydraulic cylinders you have.
The 5900 series used a couple different styles of cylinders.
The early (old) style were made from steel tubing and are
cylindrical in shape. The later (new) style were made from
aluminum blocks and are rectangular in shape. This is how
it breaks down:
Master (Upper) Cylinder
Old Style - $8.15
New Style - $4.15
Slave (Lower) Cylinder
Old Style - $13.60
New Style - $12.50
If you are unsure of which type you have, post a picture and
I'll let you know. Please be aware that some lathes can have
a mixture of old and new style cylinders. Usually, this mixture
is old style master cylinder and a new style slave cylinder. The
old style slave cylinders were somewhat problematic and when
Clausing stopped supporting the old style, they made an upgrade
kit to convert older lathes over to the newer style slave cylinders.
Shipping is $4.00 for the first seal kit and $.65 extra for each
additional kit ordered at the same time. PayPal is my preferred
way of accepting payment.
All seals and O-rings are Made In USA! No Chinese junk.
Sorry to resurrect such an old post but it is directly related to an issue I am currently experiencing. I do a little home gunsmithing and general puttering around using my Clausing 5900 lathe and, while working on a small tool to help me disassemble the trigger group for a High Standard Riot shotgun, the variable speed control failed. I was able to complete this small task but the lower cylinder (new type) was leaking quite a lot.
wlw-19958, are these rebuild kits still available? I would have PMd you except that I am somehow prohibited from doing so - presumably because I am a new member.
Thanks
Re: Can not change variable speed
wlw-19958 has not made an appearance on the board since last January, so you may not hear from him.
You should be able to send PM's. In order to do so, click on the (board) name of the individual you wish to contact. When that page opens, you should be able to click the required button, which opens the page for the message you wish to send to be composed.
Welcome to the board.
H
You should be able to send PM's. In order to do so, click on the (board) name of the individual you wish to contact. When that page opens, you should be able to click the required button, which opens the page for the message you wish to send to be composed.
Welcome to the board.
H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
Re: Can not change variable speed
Thank you.wlw-19958 has not made an appearance on the board since last January, so you may not hear from him.
You should be able to send PM's. In order to do so, click on the (board) name of the individual you wish to contact. When that page opens, you should be able to click the required button, which opens the page for the message you wish to send to be composed.
Welcome to the board.