B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Discussion on all milling machines vertical & horizontal, including but not limited to Bridgeports, Hardinge, South Bend, Clausing, Van Norman, including imports.

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jscarmozza
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Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2014 5:09 pm

B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Mon Oct 04, 2021 5:53 pm

Does anyone have experience removing the spindle motor from a B&S No.2 Plain Mill? Is there any special procedure, sequence of operation or trick involved? Thanks.
John

pete
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by pete » Mon Oct 04, 2021 6:51 pm

For something as specific as that and given it's age I'd try here. https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/a ... d-history/ No doubt someone there will know for sure.

RONALD
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by RONALD » Tue Oct 05, 2021 9:35 pm

Post your question on this group: https://groups.io/g/BrownandSharpe

I have been a long time member.

I have three B&S Mills: 1908 #1-1/2, 1925 #1, and a 1950's #2.

All are Universal mills, but there is no difference, I beleive, between plain and universal spindle motors.

There is a big difference between years tho, a 1900 #2, is nothing like a 1950's #2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-sfBZWdyPA

jscarmozza
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Wed Oct 06, 2021 2:51 pm

RONALD, you must have a BIG shop if you could fit three of these things in it! That being said, I moved it away from the wall so I could access the motor. No small feat, this is the No.2 light; at 3500 # someone at B&S has a weird sense of humor. RONALD, I removed the coweling from the motor, I see 4 motor mounting bolts that will be difficult to access unless I remove the second cowling that does not appear to be connected to anything other than the body of the mill. The start/run contacts and all of the wiring are connected to the mill body, this second cowling appears to be held on with 4 bolts; once removed access to the motor mounting bolts will be easy. My question to you, is should I remove the second cowling? Thanks.
John

jscarmozza
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:54 pm

Got it. Take out six cap screws and the second cowling/motor control cabinet comes off and everything is easily accessible, take off four nuts and give the motor a few sharpe raps and it slides right out. It's a heavy motor.
John

jscarmozza
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Tue Oct 12, 2021 9:59 am

Decision time, rewinding and refurbishing the motor is a big ticket item, but it will cost me at least half the repair cost to have it hauled away to a scrap yard and then I'm left with nothing. I'm hesitant because if the the spindle motor went is the knee motor soon to go? I'm going to have to get my super 8 ball or ouija board out for this one!

Harold_V
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by Harold_V » Tue Oct 12, 2021 4:28 pm

What failed? Three phase motors are pretty simple. Often just a bearing problem, although I acknowledge your mention of rewinding.
Is there anything special about the motor? Could a used motor be procured in lieu of that process, or does the motor have specific features making it unique to the purpose?

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

jscarmozza
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:07 pm

Harold, when I spoke to the motor shop I was told the insulation on the windings had broken down, I believe it because my shop filled with smoke within 15 seconds of starting it last week. This looks like an original motor and I figure the machine is about 80 years old, nothing lasts forever. It also looks like a special purpose motor, I went through the Grainger catalog and didn't see anything that looked like it. I've had the machine for about 25 years, although I don't use it every day I use it a lot and there are somethings that it does way better than a vertical mill, I'd miss it if it was gone.
John

Harold_V
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Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by Harold_V » Wed Oct 13, 2021 1:25 am

Damn, sure doesn't sound too good.
Motors of today don't much resemble motors from that time period, but that doesn't mean that you aren't (usually) able to procure one that will do the job. Unless the shaft and end bell are part of the mounting system, I suspect that you can mount another with a little effort.

If it is a base mount type setup, you can usually alter the mounting if necessary, so long as you can get the motor to couple up as required. Even shaft size may not be a deal killer, as you can make spacers (bushings, even keyed if necessary) that will accommodate pretty much any pulley size, assuming one is in use.

Can you post a picture of the motor and how it mounts and is coupled? Might help others to make a recommendation, maybe even provide a solution.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

jscarmozza
Posts: 510
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2014 5:09 pm

Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by jscarmozza » Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:03 am

Harold the spindle motor is at the repair shop waiting for my go no go decision. I included a photo of the motor mount location and one of the knee motor which is a similar motor but different mount. The mill is the geared type not belt driven so the proprietary mount is critical. The mount looks a little like a C-face motor mount but a C-face wouldn't work.
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Harold_V
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Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by Harold_V » Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:35 pm

Sigh! My worst fears!

I suspect that a rewind is in your future.

I'd enjoy hearing how this all plays out.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

Bob D.
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Location: Saco, ME. USA

Re: B&S No.2 Plain Mill

Post by Bob D. » Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:04 pm

Not knowing your hp or rpm of the original spindle motor,… but you will find a modern hp equal C face mount smaller in diameter than the old motor. Seems like you would be able to make an adapter mount to marry a motor to the mill. Can't tell how long the shaft has to be but you might be able to use a flat plate even which would make it simple. New motor specs are readily available, try a mock up to see what may work.
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