Newbie With "New" Old Mill Drill

[SteveHGraham]

Were you side loading the chuck when it came loose??? Tapers without draw bars should never have side loads applied !!

I just used it for drilling, straight up and down. I guess I just installed it badly.

[Glenn Brooks]

That is a R-8 style collet ,you really don't want a spindle with a Morse taper ! Tooling hard to find and sometimes really hard to remove from the spindle. The chuck end of your collet has what is called a "Jacobs" taper and is hard to remove from a chuck intentionally. Chuck or collet is many times marked as to what Jacobs taper it is. All tapers tend to be hard to remove after a period of time ,R-8 is usually the easiest.

John, I don't believe that is a "collet" I would call it an "R-8 arbor.
Correct terminology is important, especially when trying to help/advise a newbie.

Steve, now you've done it! Not supposed to ask these kinds of questions so early in the morning. It's to painful without cafine to absorb these kinds of shocks to the brain.

Isn't an arbor something that holds the work by griping the ID of the piece, And a collet something that grips the OD of the work? If so, then wouldn't these be 'R8 collets'... except, lots of manufacturers and resellers sell them as arbors.

To further clarify, I just asked Dr. google and found both R8 collets and R8 arbors listed for sale by major tool suppliers. And Hardinge sells something called a "Collet arbor" Which apparently is both a Collet that grips an arbor that holds the OD of round work - which would make the arbor a Collet and the collet an arbor... see: https://www.shophardinge.com/product.as ... 1879ar.jpg
I haven't had enuf coffee yet this morning to absorb all this.

Glenn

[spro]

Then is gets to when a spindle is a collet closer, because it was with R8 collets, then it isn't .

[earlgo]

SusanX: Did you have any other question that the tinfoil hat forum can answer? Geez and I thought only mathematicians got off on tangents...
Personally, I'd leave the chuck on the R-8 chuck arbor and hunt for some R-8 collets on ebay or at an online tool shop.
The collets look like this.

Decent tooling will cost nearly as much as the original machine.

--earlgo

[spro]

It is possible that the spindle taper is MT #3 and came with R-8 tooling. Expanding the pic of the chuck arbor, there is no evidence of contact except a tight area at major taper diameter. That would explain a few things. When that R-8 taper was used and spun in MT#3 socket, it nearly fused and was difficult to remove. MT#3 is a great taper for drilling, having in the tailstock and used with milling. I think the OP got a set of the wrong type tooling. Only one little area has been damaged and it should be all right.
We can further explore the internal taper of the spindle by one finger, you can see /feel there is an abrupt change of taper near the nose. It is either R-8 or MT#3. R-8 has an area where is or was a key pin for keeping the collet from spinning while tightening or loosening but that was in the shank. That area wasn't touched. At the very end of the chuck arbor, it was touching the internal MT#3 taper

[spro]

I don't see it anymore. Minor supposition.

[SteveM]

Expanding the pic of the chuck arbor, there is no evidence of contact except a tight area at major taper diameter.

I believe that the line you are seeing is where the taper ends and it goes to a constant diameter.

Here are a couple of things to do to check:
Put the arbor into the spindle. If it only goes in with the arbor oriented one way in the possible degrees of rotation, then it has a key and it must be R8.

Put your finger up inside and feel if there is a ridge where the inside of the spindle goes from taper to straight about an inch or so up the spindle. If there is, then it is R8.

The following document says that the spindle is available as either MT3 or R8:
http://www.normanmachinetool.com/produc ... 113728.pdf

Steve

[spro]

Yes but I'm confused about this. The original pic shows what appears to be an R8 collet now. We were going by the description it was an arbor fitting tightly to the chuck, by a Jacobs taper. Looking again, if it was a collet, a non issue for everything would come apart except for the JT.

[John Evans]

Ya got me curious last night SPRO so I tried a R-8 in a MT 3 socket ain't no way !! Really doesn't hardly start ,so be default spindle must be R-8.
John

[Glenn Brooks]

Expanding the pic of the chuck arbor, there is no evidence of contact except a tight area at major taper diameter.

.

The following document says that the spindle is available as either MT3 or R8:
http://www.normanmachinetool.com/produc ... 113728.pdf

Steve

Mystery Solved! Good work Steve and John!

[spro]

Fwiw, I tried to delete that post but it was locked in granite. I could've checked, for MT 3 is downstairs.

[Harold_V]

Fwiw, I tried to delete that post but it was locked in granite. I could've checked, for MT 3 is downstairs.

The post in question was locked to prevent your choice of deleting. Such posts serve to educate others, and should remain.

Harold