3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

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Carrdo
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3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Carrdo »

This has been an on again off again project of mine now for many years.

These are the beautifully detailed 3/4" scale couplers Al. Grigg made for his equally beautiful and detailed Boston & Albany D1a 4-6-6T double ender locomotive started by him in the 1950's and completed in 1967 or 68. There is a photo of Al's locomotive on Friends "Yankee Shop" Models... Other Designs... 3-1/2" gauge B&A 4-6-6T.. a super detailed version...

The photo is attributed to Robert Hornsby but the original is from a series of photos I took of Al's locomotive back in the early 1980's. At the time, I was corresponding extensively with C. Purington about the B&A double ender. Charlie had just acquired the original Harry Sait model and was planning to undertake a complete rebuild.

The Al. Grigg model castings did not come from Yankee Shop but were produced from patterns created originally by Harry Allin a one time member of TSME. Harry Allin built his own detailed B&A double ender in the late 1940's and there is a photo of it on the TSME website in the 1950's historic photos.

Both locomotives still exist. The Al. Grigg model is only about a 15 minute car ride from here. I never met Al. before he passed away.

But I digress.

At one time Al. did market a few sets of his couplers most likely here in Southern Ontario or in and around Montreal. I don't think Al. ever made a penny on this project due to the enormous amount of work he put into each and every unit. For example, one of the couplers shown in the first photo is stamped 13 73 AG which would be the 13th coupler made in 1973 by Al. The highest number stamped on any of the couplers I have is 17 and it is not quite finished.

To make a long story short, am thinking about producing them again in kit form but I am not going to do what Al. did; that is, make everything. This is no ratchet project. The interior of each coupler half is fully machined and each and every part has to be closely machined to function the same as the originals. Al. was a perfectionist in this regard.

I do have some of the original fixtures Al. made and but as we both have and had different equipment, I am making all new fixtures and investigating new methods to produce these parts. The first and last photo show just a few of the fixtures and special tools now made. Am doing some test machining now and there are a few surprises - I should have/could have been more observant and avoided some errors but...

Everything is being written up in detail as work proceeds. There could easily be 30 pages or more of construction notes with photos and sketches including all of the tools and fixtures but before you faint, this includes alternative ways of doing things and every problem which has been encountered and how to avoid these problems entirely or how to work around them. For example, from the third photo, how do you broach the square hole to look "square" in the coupler body (not cocked) with no straight edge or reference point anywhere? Interesting problem with an interesting solution but I am not going to talk about it. The photo makes the square look a bit off but it isn't. Even on the originals the square was a bit off.

The knuckle itself, the way Al. did it, was a 2 piece silver soldered fabrication from CR steel but I am looking at making a one piece knuckle as an alternative. A major problem will be finding a foundry which will cast in 660 bearing bronze once the existing stocks are exhausted.

Well, I guess I opened my big mouth again (to quote Howard Gorin) and now, at some point, I have to deliver.

last gasp - made a few more ratchets
Attachments
14 Coupler Parts and Fixtures Dec. 2011.jpg
15 Coupler and Pocket Cover Castings.jpg
19 Broached Half Coupler and Special Head Steady.jpg
Last edited by Carrdo on Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Andy R
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Andy R »

Jack Bodenmann already supplies beautifully detailed 3/4-in. scale couplers.

See: http://www.chaski.org/homemachinist/vie ... 30&t=91054

I have purchased three pair so far.
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tsph6500
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by tsph6500 »

Andy R wrote:Jack Bodenmann already supplies beautifully detailed 3/4-in. scale couplers.
So does John K. but Don's are Canadian. :lol:
Best regards,
Jim Leggett

Montreal Live Steamers
www.montreallivesteamers.org

A Founding Member of the Tinkerbell Scale Society - Northern Division
I'm an A.R.S.E. (Association of Railroad Steam Engineers)
Toad Swamp & Punk Hollow Railroad - Head Tycoon
The Juvenile Traction Company - CEO & Apprentice Machinist 3rd Class
White Mountain Central RR - Engineer & Fireman
Carrdo
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3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Carrdo »

Hi All,

Just as Al. did it, this is probably a labour of love. I am building these couplers again as I really like everything about them.

The castings are the old sand castings, not the more sophisticated lost wax process.

Just like their full scale counterparts, which were sophisticated but where not needed, everything was left rough.

This combination of this sophistication and roughness gives (me) the impression of a machine (and steam locomotives are machines) having brute power and force. I like that a lot. That is what I am trying to re-create here.

Real steam locomotives were made to work and work hard - they weren't given any TLC. And they didn't sit on a mantle piece.

On a related matter, if 3/4" scale is making a comeback, then people are going to have to step up to the plate and produce things in this scale again. I am doing my best in this direction. I am not afraid of competition as, in the end, the only competition is with yourself.

If I am fortunate enough to have continued good health, then I plan to continue in this direction as I really like and get satisfaction from building frustrating as it can be.
Last edited by Carrdo on Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:51 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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dwentz
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by dwentz »

Good to see someone else producing 3/4 inch scale parts. I have been looking for some truck castings but have not found any for sale.

Dale
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tsph6500
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by tsph6500 »

I think this resurgence in parts of 3/4-in locos is a very healthy sign. Hat's off to each of these builders and thank you for offering parts to our hobby.
Best regards,
Jim Leggett

Montreal Live Steamers
www.montreallivesteamers.org

A Founding Member of the Tinkerbell Scale Society - Northern Division
I'm an A.R.S.E. (Association of Railroad Steam Engineers)
Toad Swamp & Punk Hollow Railroad - Head Tycoon
The Juvenile Traction Company - CEO & Apprentice Machinist 3rd Class
White Mountain Central RR - Engineer & Fireman
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tsph6500
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by tsph6500 »

Carrdo wrote:I am not afraid of competition as, in the end, the only competition is with yourself.
Then I better throw my hat in the ring and become the fourth supplier.

Without further ado, introducing the 3/4-in scale Po'Boy Drawbar by the Juvenile Traction Company of Montreal. Perfect for that old school, low-buck, cheapskate live steamer who owns more pieces of rolling stock than he can afford to couple up.

Do you suffer from mismatched coupler pocket heights on your rag-tag consist of orphaned and bastard cars? No problem! Order our special universal fit "Z" drawbar, can be used to go up OR down. Standard nail or duplex-type* pins (nails) are available.
(* small surcharge for duplex-type nails)

Custom lengths are available for special applications (see camera car below).

Call for pricing!! Ask for Marie-Babette… :lol:

Extra nails are available at your local hardware supplier
Attachments
Shown under actual running conditions at speed!
Shown under actual running conditions at speed!
Extended drawbar for a custom camera car application
Extended drawbar for a custom camera car application
Best regards,
Jim Leggett

Montreal Live Steamers
www.montreallivesteamers.org

A Founding Member of the Tinkerbell Scale Society - Northern Division
I'm an A.R.S.E. (Association of Railroad Steam Engineers)
Toad Swamp & Punk Hollow Railroad - Head Tycoon
The Juvenile Traction Company - CEO & Apprentice Machinist 3rd Class
White Mountain Central RR - Engineer & Fireman
WJH
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by WJH »

tsph6500 wrote:
Carrdo wrote:I am not afraid of competition as, in the end, the only competition is with yourself.
Then I better throw my hat in the ring and become the fourth supplier.

Without further ado, introducing the 3/4-in scale Po'Boy Drawbar by the Juvenile Traction Company of Montreal. Perfect for that old school, low-buck, cheapskate live steamer who owns more pieces of rolling stock than he can afford to couple up.

Do you suffer from mismatched coupler pocket heights on your rag-tag consist of orphaned and bastard cars? No problem! Order our special universal fit "Z" drawbar, can be used to go up OR down. Standard nail or duplex-type* pins (nails) are available.
(* small surcharge for duplex-type nails)

Custom lengths are available for special applications (see camera car below).

Call for pricing!! Ask for Marie-Babette… :lol:

Extra nails are available at your local hardware supplier
Along the same lines, we don't even need steam locomotives, if we are simply going to sit on a plank of wood to go around a track, we should just adapt skate boards with train wheels, driven by electric motors. Does the same thing, moves us around a track and we sit on it! There is already tons of garden tractors adapted to ride on our rails!
Carrdo
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3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Carrdo »

I am going to put myself out of business with this but what Jim is offering to us (or equivalent) is what one really needs coupling wise for real world running between passenger cars or between the locomotive tender/riding car(s). The front engine coupler is another story if one does not pull heavy loads backwards.

The internal lifting pin on the Al. Grigg couplers allows them to couple and uncouple automatically as per the prototype. But it is another story entirely to pull heavy passenger loads on rough track where the cars can buck, jerk and snap back. Here one needs a much more robust and secure coupling system. Also, on rough track, the vertical misalignment experienced by the couplers when crossing over bumps, gaps in the rail, frogs or switch sections can cause the coupler knuckles to separate completely. So one still needs eyebolts and safety chains between cars or whatever system is mandated by your local club.

I have personally experienced a complete passenger car derailment and breakage of a riding car coupler located between the locomotive tender and the first passenger car in 7-1/4" gauge (the coupler was from a recognized supplier) at a very low walking speed when the locomotive engine brakes were applied just prior to entering the station. The reversal of slack between the passenger cars and the locomotive was all that it took.

This above applies much more in the prototypes. There was a famous NYC Hudson accident in the early 30's where 37 people were killed when the engineer, on level track, but on a long sweeping curve, applied the engine brakes before the train brakes. Apparently, he knew better but fatally at that moment, there was a heated argument going on in the cab between himself and the shift foreman.

The engine slowed but not the tender or the coupled passenger and baggage cars behind. The tender and train cars slammed into the back of the engine. The 37 ton tender was hurled into the air and landed 300 feet ahead of the damaged engine. Six passenger cars derailed and were crushed.

It is all about kinetic energy - it has to go somewhere, it just doesn't disappear. All in the cab were killed except the engine fireman who was pulled from under the mangled locomotive. That is how we know what was the cause of the accident.
Last edited by Carrdo on Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:53 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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tsph6500
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Re: 3/4" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by tsph6500 »

Carrdo wrote:I am going to put myself out of business with this but what Jim is offering to us (or equivalent) is what one really needs coupling wise for real world running between passenger cars or between the locomotive tender/riding car(s). The front engine coupler is another story if one does not pull heavy loads backwards.
And I hope my feeble attempt at jocularity does not offend those who's modelling skills are beyond reproach. Back to our regularly scheduled Highline Hijinx… :)
Best regards,
Jim Leggett

Montreal Live Steamers
www.montreallivesteamers.org

A Founding Member of the Tinkerbell Scale Society - Northern Division
I'm an A.R.S.E. (Association of Railroad Steam Engineers)
Toad Swamp & Punk Hollow Railroad - Head Tycoon
The Juvenile Traction Company - CEO & Apprentice Machinist 3rd Class
White Mountain Central RR - Engineer & Fireman
Carrdo
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3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Carrdo »

Look and weep.

This photo was taken about 4 years ago by Richard.
Attachments
16 Al. Grigg.jpg
Last edited by Carrdo on Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Carrdo
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3/4 and 1" Scale Couplers - Running Off Into the Woods Again

Post by Carrdo »

The coupler end.
Attachments
15 Al. Grigg.jpg
Last edited by Carrdo on Sun Jun 17, 2012 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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