Another New Guy wants a 10-wheeler

[BlackStack]

Thanks for the warm welcome, gents.

Amazing what you can learn just by saying hello around here. For instance, I didn't even know of the existence Atzberger RGS #20, but that locomotive is very much what I had in mind looks-wise. 2-1/2" scale tho.... Wow that thing is monster big.

A number of you mentioned the Mercer Camelback, I actually saw a set of castings for that on ebay recently and it DOES seem like a great bargain. Anyone happen to know what the driver diameter is on those? I could see a 2-4-0 being fun, too.

On the other hand, several Allen Mogul projects are on DSL right now, which is one reason I'd considered using that to start with. However, looking at them they have a much different "stance" than what I really see in my head, I believe it is because of the driver diameter. The Attzberger uses nearly the same diameter drivers on a larger scaled smaller loco.... It fits... On the Allen they seem a little too high-stepping for what I have in mind. Maybe swapping out the drivers for smaller diameter ones would help, unless then the spacing between the drivers looks "off" with smaller wheels? Tightening up the spacing would eliminate a lot of the potential cost savings of buying a project, as all sorts of parts wouldn't fit anymore. Well, not necessarily. Depends on what's been finished, really.

I hope I'm not run out of here on a rail for saying this, but I'm more interested in a "look" than any scale fidelity. I know I want a wooden cab, balloon stack, link and pin couplings, and lots of brass trim... Kind of a "Malcolm Furlow meets the Hooterville Cannonball" sort of style, if that makes any sense.

Maybe a 2-4-0 would be just what I need... Going to have to take a second look at that.

[Wayne Davis]

To me it sounds like you would like the Baldwin Mogul from Banning Locomotive http://www.banninglocomotiveworks.com/products.html or the 1 in Washington from AJ Reeves http://www.ajreeves.com/washington.html You could add a driver the Washington of a pony truck to the Mogul.

Wayne Davis

[John_S]

While it's entirely up to you on what style you want to build, I will follow up to the Nth degree with the Allen designs. They are solid workhorses and I guarantee any meet you go to you will see at least one running. There's probably dozens of us here (myself included) that have built them that are more than willing to help you in any possible way. They are easy (heck, mine runs!) and fairly inexpensive to build, start to finish.

I have one other suggestion though. If you are new to steam locomotives in general, spend the time to learn the principles behind their design and operation. Knowing HOW and WHY the machine works is just as important as knowing how they are put together.

[Greg_Lewis]

And I'll tell you something else. Regardless of what you decide, you'll have more fun than a person should be allowed to have.

[southwestern737]

There is an RGS 20 project on DLS, just showed in a he last couple of days
Brent

[Pontiacguy1]

You make a lot of good points about what you want. However, I would caution you about one thing on your first locomotive build: Stick to a tried and true design with minimal to no changes. For a first locomotive I would avoid things like changing driver diameter, adding a lead truck to an 0-4-0, changing driver spacing, trying to change the boiler size/shape, and the like. Things like changing the driver diameter will have an effect on other things like your lead truck, brake rigging, etc... which could be a problem down the road for you. Best thing to do is to avoid all of that and try to find something that will fit what you want to build without changing any of the major features of the design. If you are building a design that has been built several times before successfully, then you can expect to have success without too many pitfalls. If you're trying to kitbash something and have a problem, then you're going to have to figure what went wrong and how to fix it all by yourself.

IF you're into the narrow gauge, then the Artzbarger narrow gauge 4-6-0 has been built successfully by several people. As always, the Allen stuff is going to be the best as far as value and simplicity if it will fit your needs. If you are wanting that old-timey 1870's look, and a locomotive that isn't too big to deal with, maybe look at some of the British narrow gauge 2-4-0 and 0-4-0 designs. Once the chassis is built, putting American style cab, stack, domes, running boards, etc.. on them makes a really attractive narrow gauge locomotive, all the while the running gear is unchanged.

[Gary Armitstead]

Blackstack,

Because you are just getting started in this great hobby, I would have to say that the previous comments to you about the Allen engines are so true. It's a simple design proven over many, many years and you can see them running all over the U.S. and other countries. Right now, Gene Allen engines are getting pricey both finished and partially completed. But you CAN find them. I just sold my Allen ten-wheeler (running on air, but stored for many years) to a young man who I felt could finish the engine (AND had the resources to do it right). I was turning over my engine to this young man to continue the "legacy", a new steward so to speak .

As a new, inexperienced builder and never built a steam engine, you need to stay away from trying to "re-design" a locomotive to custom make it to look like you want it to look ("your vision"). That opens a can of worms, adds frustration and most likely you will lose interest and NEVER finish it. You hear this "story" many times around club tracks. Heed their advice. Start with a simple, PROVEN design and get it built. With the experience gained from this build, you can then move on to your
pet project".

BTW, you mentioned you wanted a "wooden cab".....well Steve Alley (new owner of Allen Models) has a nice set of castings that makes a beautiful cab or either the mogul or the ten-wheeler. And these castings are cast iron, not aluminum like Gene's previous "wood cab" or his Baldwin cab.

Good luck with your decision.

[Soot n' Cinders]

I'll chime in again about the customization. Go with a proven running gear like PontiacGuy suggested. The cab and decorative parts can be customized all you want to get rid of the stock look but still uses a proven running gear. Major modification to the running gear turns into a frustrating rabbit hole, especially when it comes to the valve gear itself. The dimensions there are probably the most critical on the whole locomotive in my opinion as any significant error will result in poor running or unable to get the locomotive to run square. That being said, basically anything above the frame can be modified at will.
I know a guy who built a 2.5" model of one of the tiny Porter moguls using the running gear from a Little Engines old mogul.

[Fender]

A number of you mentioned the Mercer Camelback, I actually saw a set of castings for that on ebay recently and it DOES seem like a great bargain. Anyone happen to know what the driver diameter is on those? I could see a 2-4-0 being fun, too.

On the other hand, several Allen Mogul projects are on DSL right now, which is one reason I'd considered using that to start with. However, looking at them they have a much different "stance" than what I really see in my head, I believe it is because of the driver diameter. The Attzberger uses nearly the same diameter drivers on a larger scaled smaller loco.... It fits... On the Allen they seem a little too high-stepping for what I have in mind. Maybe swapping out the drivers for smaller diameter ones would help, unless then the spacing between the drivers looks "off" with smaller wheels?

I have one of the Mercer 0-4-0 camelbacks, and the drivers are 6.25" diameter, to answer that question. It is a fine choice if you want a smaller loco.

As far as the "look" you are after, also consider the Allen 2-8-0 consolidation. The Allen website says it has 5.375" drivers (I think they mean 6.375") vs. 8" drivers on the ten-wheeler.

Two other things about the Allen 2-8-0: it shares many common parts with the 2-6-0 and ten-wheeler, and an added bonus is that it uses Baker valve gear, which is much more accessible for maintenance and timing than the Stephenson gear used on the mogul and ten-wheeler.

[Dick_Morris]

My Allen Ten Wheeler has just 50 lbs on the front truck.

Thanks. Good to know.

[Greg_Lewis]

You wrote that you'd like a wood cab and lots of brass. Think about an Allen American. The 19th century prototypes were covered with brass and varnished cabs. Do a search here for Jack Bodenmann's American project for a look at what such a project could offer.

[Wayne Davis]

The Railroad Supply American is also an option. http://www.railroadsupply.com

Wayne