Locogear shay
Locogear shay
Anybody ever deal with www.Locogear.com. I am looking at building a shay and this is the largest one I can find. I am trying to go big my first time so all the parts are a little more robust and more easily held and machined. My thouht is that they should pull hard and are pretty basic. Lots of bar stock and exposed items. Not an eligant beast at all. I like it!
-
willy
Corrected link http://www.locogear.com
What ever blows your bubble I suppose. If you can afford it, go for it!
Mind you without a true heavy load (alot of people) she wont work hard.
What ever blows your bubble I suppose. If you can afford it, go for it!
Mind you without a true heavy load (alot of people) she wont work hard.
-
Bill Shields
- Posts: 10561
- Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:57 am
- Location: 39.367, -75.765
- Contact:
Big and First Time
Can be an expensive mistake if you aren't truly ready for the challenges ahead of you.
Smaller has the same challenges, require less expenditure of resources while you lean...
Smaller has the same challenges, require less expenditure of resources while you lean...
Would not a larger engine be easier to fabricate. It seems that the precision needed for working on smaller items would be much higher than a larger piece. Im not trying to say I will not strive to be as close to print as possible I just know that my skills will need to be built up to a higher level. As faw as price goes $1500 for a set of castings doesn't sound to bad. Most of the other pieces look to be bar and plate. Most of those small pieces will be donated from the scrap bin here at the mill. From my view the cost of this engine is much cheaper than most anythings else. Am I wrong 
Im not being smart I really don't know if I am missing a piece.
Im not being smart I really don't know if I am missing a piece.
Paperman,
I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to your question. Most people would tackle a simpler loco as a first project, such as an 0-4-0. But it depends on your interest. Are you building a loco to have something to run, or for the challenge of building it? If the former, the three-truck Shay will take longer to get running (a negative), and be harder to transport. If the latter, a small engine like an 0-4-0 may not be sufficiently challenging or satisfying to you.
I do think you are taking the right course of building a loco that has already been designed, and for which parts are available.
I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to your question. Most people would tackle a simpler loco as a first project, such as an 0-4-0. But it depends on your interest. Are you building a loco to have something to run, or for the challenge of building it? If the former, the three-truck Shay will take longer to get running (a negative), and be harder to transport. If the latter, a small engine like an 0-4-0 may not be sufficiently challenging or satisfying to you.
I do think you are taking the right course of building a loco that has already been designed, and for which parts are available.
Dan Watson
Chattanooga, TN
Chattanooga, TN
Fender,
Very true on the been built and tested part. I was hoping to find something a bit more proven. I just can’t seem to find what I am looking for. I did send for the plans from Mr. Schroeder(SP) but then found this set that is larger. My thought was it should be easier to build the larger one. But with the limited information on the build-up that makes it not as good of a choice for my level of knowledge. So many and so few options.
Very true on the been built and tested part. I was hoping to find something a bit more proven. I just can’t seem to find what I am looking for. I did send for the plans from Mr. Schroeder(SP) but then found this set that is larger. My thought was it should be easier to build the larger one. But with the limited information on the build-up that makes it not as good of a choice for my level of knowledge. So many and so few options.
-
Russ Hanscom
- Posts: 1955
- Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 11:10 pm
- Location: Farmington, NM
I purchased most of a set of castings some time ago with the intent of making a D model - four trucks, but chipmaking is still almost a year away; need to finish the house etc.
One thing to consider is the gears required. Unless Locogear has added them recently, making the gear set can be a major effort or expense. There are threads on this forum regarding cutting bevel gear sets and there is also a forum on Locogear with posts of some of the engines under construction.
The relative comparison between this any any other engine is probably the level of effort and detail you intend to invest. I did not consider this an easier project, possibly the opposite - I just have a fascination with the particular engine.
One thing to consider is the gears required. Unless Locogear has added them recently, making the gear set can be a major effort or expense. There are threads on this forum regarding cutting bevel gear sets and there is also a forum on Locogear with posts of some of the engines under construction.
The relative comparison between this any any other engine is probably the level of effort and detail you intend to invest. I did not consider this an easier project, possibly the opposite - I just have a fascination with the particular engine.
I have thought of the cost of gearing and such. As stated before I am not looking to build a scale engine. I am not a rivet counter. I really appreciate the people that can do that type of work and enjoy it. It’s just not me. Items like the line shaft I would look at using commercial u-joints and SAE spline shafting. While it is not scale it will likely be as good or better. I would also like it to roll on roller bearings and anything else that a person can fit to make it a better engine.
Hi Paperman,
I went through the same decision process and still think about it! The ShayLocomotive and the LocoGear Shay are very appealing. However, at the end of the day, my first attempt is a 3/4" Kozo. Still want to build a larger loco but I have a lot to learn about machining and live steaming.
In addition to the great advice you've already read from experienced live steamers, here's some thoughts from a new guy...
Probably the ShayLocomotive and LocoGear engines require the same precision as the 3/4" Kozo.
John and Ken have great reputations and would offer you support. In addition, Nelson has put a tremendous amount of effort in to a site that documents his build and modifications.
Other's have advised me to make what I really want. "If it's a 7-1/2" gauge loco, just do it." I sincerely respect their advice. But I have so much to learn and need to rely on the Kozo build process - step by step - to learn this stuff and not get frustrated and quit.
Now that I've started down that road, no regrets. I'm learning things that I didn't know I had to learn. Kozo has done an amazing job of sharing machining methods. Chaski offers a huge range of live steam knowledge. The Yahoo LiveSteamShays forum has been a terrific help to understanding the specific design of Shays.
Have not spent budget money on any castings yet. They don't exist - until Friends Models http://www.friendsmodels.com/ gathers enough of our support to make a set.
But have spent bucks on bar stock and have a bucket of poorly machined parts to prove it. For me, it's relatively comfortable to learn that way.
Plus it has taken two years just to get a shop set up with any sense of order and supporting tooling.
A larger Shay someday! But right now, I have to learn how/why things are correctly done the way they are done. I still have to learn how a Lima Locomotive Works Shay steam engine and its valve action and gearing were meant to be built. It's a lot to understand.
Hope this helps. Good luck with your project! Looking forward to hearing what you decide to do.
Tim
I went through the same decision process and still think about it! The ShayLocomotive and the LocoGear Shay are very appealing. However, at the end of the day, my first attempt is a 3/4" Kozo. Still want to build a larger loco but I have a lot to learn about machining and live steaming.
In addition to the great advice you've already read from experienced live steamers, here's some thoughts from a new guy...
Probably the ShayLocomotive and LocoGear engines require the same precision as the 3/4" Kozo.
John and Ken have great reputations and would offer you support. In addition, Nelson has put a tremendous amount of effort in to a site that documents his build and modifications.
Other's have advised me to make what I really want. "If it's a 7-1/2" gauge loco, just do it." I sincerely respect their advice. But I have so much to learn and need to rely on the Kozo build process - step by step - to learn this stuff and not get frustrated and quit.
Now that I've started down that road, no regrets. I'm learning things that I didn't know I had to learn. Kozo has done an amazing job of sharing machining methods. Chaski offers a huge range of live steam knowledge. The Yahoo LiveSteamShays forum has been a terrific help to understanding the specific design of Shays.
Have not spent budget money on any castings yet. They don't exist - until Friends Models http://www.friendsmodels.com/ gathers enough of our support to make a set.
But have spent bucks on bar stock and have a bucket of poorly machined parts to prove it. For me, it's relatively comfortable to learn that way.
Plus it has taken two years just to get a shop set up with any sense of order and supporting tooling.
A larger Shay someday! But right now, I have to learn how/why things are correctly done the way they are done. I still have to learn how a Lima Locomotive Works Shay steam engine and its valve action and gearing were meant to be built. It's a lot to understand.
Hope this helps. Good luck with your project! Looking forward to hearing what you decide to do.
Tim
Ken's Shays
I have used Ken's casting on non-shay projects and the castings are top-quality. I also have a full set of plans and they are great and easy to read. I also have the fortune opportunity to run many of his personal shays as well as shays built from his plans/castings, and they all run beautifully. I would not hesitate to buy from him.
I can't comment on the Locogear stuff as I have not seen anything of theirs yet. Don't take this message as choosing one over the other as it is only a one-sided comparison.
Matt Mason
Editor
The Home Railway Journal
www.homerailwayjournal.com
I can't comment on the Locogear stuff as I have not seen anything of theirs yet. Don't take this message as choosing one over the other as it is only a one-sided comparison.
Matt Mason
Editor
The Home Railway Journal
www.homerailwayjournal.com
Boilerworks,
My original paln in live steam was a traction engine but after I learned that Mich. code didn't allow my boiler those plans were killed. The reason for building an tractor was to be able to take it most anywhere and use it. So now to be within the code I must build a locomotive. The left over material from the traction boiler is all code and I would love to find something in that size. 10" shell. Also with the avalible track that I know of close to me is 7.5". www.whitecreekrr.com Nice place from the web page. I have yet to visit as trains were not my intended project. I want to build something I can use. At 27 years old I have lots of time to build it(I hope).
My original paln in live steam was a traction engine but after I learned that Mich. code didn't allow my boiler those plans were killed. The reason for building an tractor was to be able to take it most anywhere and use it. So now to be within the code I must build a locomotive. The left over material from the traction boiler is all code and I would love to find something in that size. 10" shell. Also with the avalible track that I know of close to me is 7.5". www.whitecreekrr.com Nice place from the web page. I have yet to visit as trains were not my intended project. I want to build something I can use. At 27 years old I have lots of time to build it(I hope).
Its the largest one you can find because its a model of the largest Shay (OK, maybe the second largest...) I know John Johnson of Locogear personally and I can attest to the fact that his castings are of the finest quality and his customer relations are top-notch. The machining is not for the faint of heart but it isn't rocket science, either. John uses a small lathe and a mill-drill to do all his work so the tooling can be more user-friendly than on a rod engine.
John related to me that this particular locomotive, WM #6, was rated for NINE 70-ton cars of coal on its intended route.
Locogear's castings are all ductile iron and I know that they machine like butter without voids or hard spots.
John related to me that this particular locomotive, WM #6, was rated for NINE 70-ton cars of coal on its intended route.
Locogear's castings are all ductile iron and I know that they machine like butter without voids or hard spots.