One Last Shorty

Where users can chronicle their builds. Start one thread and continue to add on to it.

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ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

Steggy wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 12:41 am
Odyknuck wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:02 pmLED's typically require 2 to 3 volts DC, so when using 12 VDC the resister needs to be a higher wattage as something needs to remove the heat created by the circuit.
It depends on the forward current.

The LEDs you see as indicators on the front panel of your PC typically draw 10 to 15 milliamps, with a forward voltage of 2.1 to 2.3. The power dissipation is trivial—about 34 milliwatts, and can be readily handled with a 1/4 watt resistor. On the other hand, the LEDs Carl is using in his project can draw quite a bit of current, necessitating the use of a substantial resistor, which will get quite warm.

Don’t try to Easter Egg something like this. The on-line calculators that Carl mentions are generally accurate and will help you avoid that vile-smelling smoke that comes out when you goof.
Thanks Steggy for the additional details! Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

DETAILS - The Butcher and Candlestick Maker

It's time for another "quick hit" detail description for car #7. However, if you're wondering about the post title...will ask, what's missing? The answer to that would be...The Baker!

Peasleecreek once again introduced me to a little known piece of old time railroad passenger car trivia...the Baker Water Heater. Like most heating "systems" in vintage passenger car equipment, those that sat closest to the heater were probably more than warm enough...while those seated further away might have been chilled. Suspect the Baker heating system was a slight improvement over the pot belly stove(s) at the end of the car.

From the outside of the railroad car, you wouldn't know there was a Baker on board, if not for the cover over the water expansion/fill tank on the clerestory roof. Usually, where there's a tank on the roof, there's also a stack nearby to vent the primary stove chamber. So to start this build, here's a photo of an old time passenger car from the Marquette & Huron Mountain railroad. The tank cover is visible on the right end of the car roof.

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Inside the car, the heater itself was a bit more futuristic looking. The next photo is an artist rendition of the heating stove, the connection to the expansion/fill tank on the roof and the water piping that ran along the car wall and under the seats.

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A cutaway diagram of the Baker heater shows the internal construction. Supposedly, the internal coil was covered with hot coals. The difference in water temperature between the heated and cooled water generated water flow in the pipes. As such, there were no pumps or other moving parts. Except for the needle on the temperature/pressure gauge in the riser to the roof.

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Using a line drawing of the roof cover profile, approximated the cover size and roughed out some dimension. Headed over to the aluminum bucket and found a couple pieces of scrap that could be screwed and JB Welded together to make a large enough "cover". After that, rounded the top corners. Cut the taper on the bottom to match the roof angle. Milled a recess in the one end for the fill valve and funnel and spun a piece of brass to look like a miniature pressure relief valve on top. Had an old pet cock valve that donated itself to the effort. Turned a piece of aluminum rod to make a funnel and bent some brass flat stock to make mounting lugs. The result of that work...


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When completed, the cover assembly was sand blasted and painted satin black and attached to car #7's roof with some #2 brass hex head lag screws (Microfasteners.com) next to the stack for the heater.

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And so, the railroad prez and his guests can ride with a little bit of old time fashion warmth...even in the late 1800's! Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
djjh87
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by djjh87 »

Carl 10 ft is modest opinion I would put you at 3 or under feet. Now that being said I'm more of the 10 ft distance.
As for example my tender will shake the purest. Great job on #7. Jim
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Odyknuck
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by Odyknuck »

Well Carl, you may not think it however based on your work I think you're in the Rivet counter category.
Me, I'm in the good enough category lol. :?
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Steggy
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by Steggy »

ccvstmr wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:47 amPeasleecreek once again introduced me to a little known piece of old time railroad passenger car trivia...the Baker Water Heater. Like most heating "systems" in vintage passenger car equipment, those that sat closest to the heater were probably more than warm enough...while those seated further away might have been chilled. Suspect the Baker heating system was a slight improvement over the pot belly stove(s) at the end of the car.
Cool! Er...I mean, hot!

As you noted, it all depended on where you were seated in the car. The thermo-siphon principle used by the Baker heater worked better in theory than in practice. With little actual pressure in the system, the hot water always seemed to take a short-cut through the radiators that were closest to the heater. Also, the fire had to be carefully tended. It was possible to over-fire the unit and turn it into a boiler, usually with decidedly unpleasant results.

Most mainline railroads quickly moved on to low-pressure, saturated steam heat when Egbert Gold patented the “Vapor” car-heating system in the early 1900s. That was after a few roads had tried piping high-pressure steam directly from the locomotive into the cars for heating. In a wreck, passengers went from being burned up in a fire started by an overturned coal stove to be boiled like lobsters when the car’s plumbing broke open and filled the interior with live steam. :D I imagine many an attorney got rich from filing lawsuits on behalf of the boiled passengers’ survivors.
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ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

Jim, Ody & Steggy...thanks for your thoughts. Your kind words are appreciated! Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

Steggy...aware of several VAPOR Corp. products made for the railroad industry during my Amtrak working years. One of the most notable items was the VAPOR Corp. steam generators used for passenger car heating in the late 70's/early 80's...before Amtrak switched over to full HEP head end power heated equipment. Is that how Vapor Corp. got it's start? Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

DETAILS - Going Down Under, Part 1

For this post, thought we take a look at one of car #7's undercarriage details. 1st item to call out was a water tank...or pseudo water tank. The car "design" had a small galley near the rear of the car. At some point, water would be needed for cooking/cleaning. Figured somewhere along the way if there was ever a real #7 made, air pressure from the brake pipe would be used to pressurize the water tank to force water up into the cabin. Never got as far to figure out freeze protection for Winter operations. Oh well, today the pits, tomorrow the wrinkles!

While imagining how such a water tank would be fabricated, figured I couldn't go wrong by getting some copper fittings from one of the big box stores. During a visit to Menards, latched on to (2) 1.5" copper end caps and(1) 1.5" copper coupling. This way, they'd all be the same outside diameter. Started by taping the parts together to see how this would look under the car floor.

Size and length looked like something that might have been built for a real #7. Estimated the tank capacity to be about 80 gallons. Would eventually, drill out the coupling dimple "stop" so internal air could be vented when the (3) pieces were soft soldered together. Rolled a couple pieces of flat brass to use as splice plates inside the tank.

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Then, had to devise a way to mount the tank. Used this method to mount the 1.25" diameter air reservoirs for cars #5 and #6. No reason NOT to use this method again to mount the water tank. Borrowed a 1.5" diameter mill cutter. Cut a couple pieces of 3/4" aluminum channel and cut out a 1.5" diameter arc in the channel to act as a tank craddle.

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Eventually, the ends would also be shaped and mounting holes drilled.

3/32" copper plated steel TIG welding rod was used to make the stay rods. The tank support rods would be located to "hide" the soldered seams. After guesstimating the rod length, used a floating die holder in the lathe to CAREFULLY thread the rod ends for some 2-56 square nuts.

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Time for a quick "fit" check under the car. Tank leg supports fit just inside the queen post beams.

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Next, a water tank is going to need a drain of some kind. Found a used 5/16" MPT "T" fitting in the pipe fitting box that seemed perfect for this application. Cobbled together a handle and threaded insert mount for the T. Added a drain leg and there, ready for service was (1) drain valve!

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Used the drilled out coupling dimple stop to locate the hole for the 5/16" threaded MPT drain valve stem. Secured the valve assembly with a spot of Loctite.

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Eventually, the entire assembly would get an abrasive grit sand blast. When that was completed, the nice copper plated TIG welding rod was bare steel. The tank assembly would get a couple coats of satin black paint to adequately cover all the surfaces whether looking at the tank right-side up or up-side down.

Next time, will examine a couple other widget gizmos down-under. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
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Steggy
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by Steggy »

ccvstmr wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:27 am Steggy...aware of several VAPOR Corp. products made for the railroad industry during my Amtrak working years. One of the most notable items was the VAPOR Corp. steam generators used for passenger car heating in the late 70's/early 80's...before Amtrak switched over to full HEP head end power heated equipment. Is that how Vapor Corp. got it's start? Carl B.
Vapor Corp. was previously Vapor Heating Corp, which was previously Vapor Car Heating Company, Inc., which was previously Vapor Car Heating Company, dating back to c. 1904, well before there was a market for a railroad steam generator. Egbert Gold’s original system had pressure-reducing valves and gauges mounted on the fireman’s side of the boiler backhead. Steam pressure going back to the cars was maintained at 15 PSI, no matter the boiler pressure. What made the system popular with the railroads was it was all automatic and relatively low maintenance.

The Vapor-Clarkson steam generator was developed in the 1930s—I believe the “Clarkson” part of the name was dropped during the 1950s. When I was with Vapor, I would occasionally have to dig into the archives to help a road with really old equipment when they need parts no longer in production. Steam generator drawings in the archives from the 1950s onward did not have the “Clarkson” name on them.

Vapor steam generators were used in almost all North American Diesel-electric locos that were meant to pull varnish. Elesco had a competing product, but the honchos at EMD preferred Vapor steam generators and offered them as extras on E- and F-units. An F-unit equipped with steam generators was (I think) four feet longer than a freight F-unit.

My recollection was EMD preferred Vapor because they (Vapor) produced everything needed to equip a loco to provide steam heat, meaning steam generator, all required valves, and steam conduits to pass steam to the cars. The only part of the system furnished by EMD was the feedwater tank. Pullman also preferred Vapor products, again because the heating system was sold as a package, including steam conduits, radiators, potable water heater, valves, control panel and mercury-tube thermostats (a trade ad c. 1940). When Carrier introduced air conditioning to rail cars in the 1920s, Vapor modified their control system to work with the A/C, as well as the heat.
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Music isn’t at all difficult.  All you gotta do is play the right notes at the right time!  :D
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makinsmoke
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by makinsmoke »

Santa Fe’s F unit passenger fleet had the steam generators mounted in the B units typically.

One of the first mods for a Santa Fe Athearn A unit was file off the steam generator exhaust stack on the rear of the roof.

Lol.
ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

Steggy wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 5:27 am
Vapor steam generators were used in almost all North American Diesel-electric locos that were meant to pull varnish. Elesco had a competing product, but the honchos at EMD preferred Vapor steam generators and offered them as extras on E- and F-units. An F-unit equipped with steam generators was (I think) four feet longer than a freight F-unit.
And now...we know THE REST of the VAPOR Corp. story! Thanks for that look back.

btw...believe those longer F units with steam generators located at the tail end were classified as FP's. Whereas there was something like 5000 "F" units made of various classifications, think there were only 500 of the "FP's" made. Thx again. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
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Re: One Last Shorty

Post by ccvstmr »

DETAILS - Going Down Under, Part 2

As I close out describing the underside of the car body, thought I'd post another "quick hit" and share some of other under-carriage items. Normally I would NOT have given what goes under the car a 2nd thought. That area falls into that...out of sight-out of mind category. The items down under were more an exercise to see what I could do with such detail work. At the least, I KNEW they were there. THEN...if anybody else did look underneath, they'd have some surprises waiting for them.

When cars #5 and #6 were built, I was lucky enough to find someone able to forward photos AND dimensions of the air brake reservoir and the integrated brake cylinder and K style (?) brake valve. Once again, with that information, was able to design and fabricate parts that looked the part.

The air reservoir was made from some 1.25" diameter aluminum tubing. Machined some aluminum round stock to make the tank ends. Pushed those into the tube and glued those in place with Superglue. Added the same type of mounts as the water tank and added a pet cock for a "tank drain". Here's the original batch of reservoirs made prior to painting.

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Fabricating the brake valve and cylinder was a little more involved. Took several pieces and some screwing and soldering to cobble these parts into one assembly. Here's (2) valve/cylinder assemblies from the original build. Added a mounting "pad" to affix this assembly under the car.

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Good thing I opted to make extras of the reservoirs and brake cylinder/valves. These parts now had a home under car #7.

On the other side of the car opposite the water tank, the air reservoir and brake valve/cylinder were mounted between the queen post timbers. Also visible is the poly tubing and fittings for the air brakes on the trucks located along the center sill. There's a pig tail to connect the truck brakes to the brake pipe line. All trucks are connected to the "brake pipe" with Clippard MQC-3 quick connectors. This way, trucks can be removed without having to cut the poly tubing. Small price to pay for the extra hardware for ease of service.

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Stepping back, can see the rest of the car under floor. The "U" brackets located near the ends of the car...are to limit the truck swing in the event of derailment (yes, it can happen even with short wheel base rolling stock).

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By limiting the truck swing, don't have to worry about damaging the brake tubing or quick connectors. The "U" brackets would bear against the inside of the truck timber frame. Here's a closer look at the truck swing limiters when car #5 (combine) was being fitted.

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Next time when I crawl out from under the car, will take a look at some of the top side details. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
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